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	<title>Comments on: The Revealer</title>
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	<link>http://www.benedictionblogson.com/2004/11/04/the-revealer/</link>
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	<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 11:29:06 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: ganns</title>
		<link>http://www.benedictionblogson.com/2004/11/04/the-revealer/#comment-3205</link>
		<dc:creator>ganns</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 08 Nov 2004 12:20:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ss75.shared.server-system.net/~benedictionblogson.com/?p=1066#comment-3205</guid>
		<description>More weakness than strength regardless of culture, Bene, but in Asia, silence is also seen as a sign of discipline and inner strength.

It's a paradox I'd love to change, because I think there should be times when we at least make our positions clear, albeit in fora and in ways that communicate a certain mutual respect between opposing parties.  The few times I've tried to be political on my blog, for instance, I've found myself backing down pretty easily, perhaps because I hesitate to bat the bee's hive more than I should.

It's an attitude I'm working on changing, especially with LIVEtheLIFE. If we don't speak up, especially from our Christian perspective, the tendency is for us to let the wrongs go unpunished.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>More weakness than strength regardless of culture, Bene, but in Asia, silence is also seen as a sign of discipline and inner strength.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s a paradox I&#8217;d love to change, because I think there should be times when we at least make our positions clear, albeit in fora and in ways that communicate a certain mutual respect between opposing parties.  The few times I&#8217;ve tried to be political on my blog, for instance, I&#8217;ve found myself backing down pretty easily, perhaps because I hesitate to bat the bee&#8217;s hive more than I should.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s an attitude I&#8217;m working on changing, especially with LIVEtheLIFE. If we don&#8217;t speak up, especially from our Christian perspective, the tendency is for us to let the wrongs go unpunished.</p>
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		<title>By: saint</title>
		<link>http://www.benedictionblogson.com/2004/11/04/the-revealer/#comment-3204</link>
		<dc:creator>saint</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 06 Nov 2004 08:41:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ss75.shared.server-system.net/~benedictionblogson.com/?p=1066#comment-3204</guid>
		<description>"We don't think of ourselves as living in 'Christian' nations, as a middle players on the world stage the drive to uphold values, freedom and morality takes different form."

I too, think you have nailed it there, Bene. 

I don't know enough about the U.S. scene but it may also be true that not wearing our politics on our religious sleeve is seen by our American friends as a weakness, not a strength.  

From a distance, I get the impression Americans place a lot of faith in the political system to wield transformation, and have so much pride in their own, whereas many in other countries don't have such faith, or have seen its failings - both in the US and in their own countries - more starkly.  Hence the different outlooks.  And that would also influence Christian outlooks outside the U.S. as well.

And then there are just cultural differences: in the case of us Australians, we tend not to venerate our leaders - be they politicians or otherwise.  

And while Christians in Australia are a minority (most who self identify as Christians are nominal; we are a pretty secular society), we nevertheless had a taste of (nasty) sectarianism within politics with the Catholic church in the past.  Which also makes some - Christians and non Christians - nervous about repeat performances.

The litmus test I guess, for Christians, is discernment: are we being human participants in the divine action or are we advocating human action to promulgate some so-called divine plan? My understanding is that God calls us to the former.  And He may call you to a different way than me.

Even so, I personally chose to 'sit lightly to it' when it comes to politics.  I can work within the political system, through it, even despite it. Sometimes the wise response is not controversy but silence, not seeking power but embodying weakness, so that where our power ends, His begins.  Not to make politics your god and not to try and appropriate God to your political views just as some politicans do (an Aussie pundit living in Washington recently called it 'wag-the-god' politics) 

And above all, don't get despondent. Either God is sovereign or He is not.

Me thinks He has all things under control.

Hmm, I've drivelled on. Why am I writing this?  

I really should just say, thanks for your encouragement and example. And thanks for the plug.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;We don&#8217;t think of ourselves as living in &#8216;Christian&#8217; nations, as a middle players on the world stage the drive to uphold values, freedom and morality takes different form.&#8221;</p>
<p>I too, think you have nailed it there, Bene. </p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know enough about the U.S. scene but it may also be true that not wearing our politics on our religious sleeve is seen by our American friends as a weakness, not a strength.  </p>
<p>From a distance, I get the impression Americans place a lot of faith in the political system to wield transformation, and have so much pride in their own, whereas many in other countries don&#8217;t have such faith, or have seen its failings - both in the US and in their own countries - more starkly.  Hence the different outlooks.  And that would also influence Christian outlooks outside the U.S. as well.</p>
<p>And then there are just cultural differences: in the case of us Australians, we tend not to venerate our leaders - be they politicians or otherwise.  </p>
<p>And while Christians in Australia are a minority (most who self identify as Christians are nominal; we are a pretty secular society), we nevertheless had a taste of (nasty) sectarianism within politics with the Catholic church in the past.  Which also makes some - Christians and non Christians - nervous about repeat performances.</p>
<p>The litmus test I guess, for Christians, is discernment: are we being human participants in the divine action or are we advocating human action to promulgate some so-called divine plan? My understanding is that God calls us to the former.  And He may call you to a different way than me.</p>
<p>Even so, I personally chose to &#8217;sit lightly to it&#8217; when it comes to politics.  I can work within the political system, through it, even despite it. Sometimes the wise response is not controversy but silence, not seeking power but embodying weakness, so that where our power ends, His begins.  Not to make politics your god and not to try and appropriate God to your political views just as some politicans do (an Aussie pundit living in Washington recently called it &#8216;wag-the-god&#8217; politics) </p>
<p>And above all, don&#8217;t get despondent. Either God is sovereign or He is not.</p>
<p>Me thinks He has all things under control.</p>
<p>Hmm, I&#8217;ve drivelled on. Why am I writing this?  </p>
<p>I really should just say, thanks for your encouragement and example. And thanks for the plug.</p>
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		<title>By: Bene Diction</title>
		<link>http://www.benedictionblogson.com/2004/11/04/the-revealer/#comment-3203</link>
		<dc:creator>Bene Diction</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Nov 2004 11:22:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ss75.shared.server-system.net/~benedictionblogson.com/?p=1066#comment-3203</guid>
		<description>I think too that having seen the hold the Catholic church held on Quebec and the resounding fallout from the cultural revolution for the French population, we Canadians, though vocal, recognize the dangers in wedding politics and religion. I think the UK could say the same about Northern Ireland.

Don't you find though Ganns, that our choice not to wear our politics on our religious sleeve is seen by our American friends as a weakness, not a strength?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think too that having seen the hold the Catholic church held on Quebec and the resounding fallout from the cultural revolution for the French population, we Canadians, though vocal, recognize the dangers in wedding politics and religion. I think the UK could say the same about Northern Ireland.</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t you find though Ganns, that our choice not to wear our politics on our religious sleeve is seen by our American friends as a weakness, not a strength?</p>
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		<title>By: irene</title>
		<link>http://www.benedictionblogson.com/2004/11/04/the-revealer/#comment-3202</link>
		<dc:creator>irene</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Nov 2004 11:22:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ss75.shared.server-system.net/~benedictionblogson.com/?p=1066#comment-3202</guid>
		<description>Wow! Thanks for the plug, Bene! :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow! Thanks for the plug, Bene! <img src='http://www.benedictionblogson.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: ganns</title>
		<link>http://www.benedictionblogson.com/2004/11/04/the-revealer/#comment-3201</link>
		<dc:creator>ganns</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Nov 2004 11:05:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ss75.shared.server-system.net/~benedictionblogson.com/?p=1066#comment-3201</guid>
		<description>Oh, I think culture obviously plays a huge role.  Asian God-blogs (Oriental, not including Australia and New Zealand perhaps because of their Western orientation) also tend to avoid the political perhaps because by nature we tend to avoid conflict.  Even with the freedom afforded us by the relative anonymity of the Internet, Asian god-blogs have a long way to go in terms of stirring up controversy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, I think culture obviously plays a huge role.  Asian God-blogs (Oriental, not including Australia and New Zealand perhaps because of their Western orientation) also tend to avoid the political perhaps because by nature we tend to avoid conflict.  Even with the freedom afforded us by the relative anonymity of the Internet, Asian god-blogs have a long way to go in terms of stirring up controversy.</p>
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		<title>By: ganns</title>
		<link>http://www.benedictionblogson.com/2004/11/04/the-revealer/#comment-3200</link>
		<dc:creator>ganns</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Nov 2004 11:02:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ss75.shared.server-system.net/~benedictionblogson.com/?p=1066#comment-3200</guid>
		<description>Honored and thrilled, Bene! Now to go write something political to live up to the company I'm with!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Honored and thrilled, Bene! Now to go write something political to live up to the company I&#8217;m with!</p>
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		<title>By: Michelle</title>
		<link>http://www.benedictionblogson.com/2004/11/04/the-revealer/#comment-3199</link>
		<dc:creator>Michelle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Nov 2004 09:59:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ss75.shared.server-system.net/~benedictionblogson.com/?p=1066#comment-3199</guid>
		<description>Oh my Bene - thanks for the mention!  Now I'm probably going to come down with that lack-of-something-decent-to-say "virus" again... :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh my Bene - thanks for the mention!  Now I&#8217;m probably going to come down with that lack-of-something-decent-to-say &#8220;virus&#8221; again&#8230; <img src='http://www.benedictionblogson.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: Bene D</title>
		<link>http://www.benedictionblogson.com/2004/11/04/the-revealer/#comment-3198</link>
		<dc:creator>Bene D</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Nov 2004 08:59:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ss75.shared.server-system.net/~benedictionblogson.com/?p=1066#comment-3198</guid>
		<description>Okay thanks Jeff. Fixed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Okay thanks Jeff. Fixed.</p>
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		<title>By: Jeff Sharlet</title>
		<link>http://www.benedictionblogson.com/2004/11/04/the-revealer/#comment-3197</link>
		<dc:creator>Jeff Sharlet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Nov 2004 08:23:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ss75.shared.server-system.net/~benedictionblogson.com/?p=1066#comment-3197</guid>
		<description>Thanks, Bene, but credit for that Revealer post goes to my colleague, Kathryn Joyce.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks, Bene, but credit for that Revealer post goes to my colleague, Kathryn Joyce.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark Byron</title>
		<link>http://www.benedictionblogson.com/2004/11/04/the-revealer/#comment-3196</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Byron</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 05 Nov 2004 05:29:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://ss75.shared.server-system.net/~benedictionblogson.com/?p=1066#comment-3196</guid>
		<description>"We don't think of ourselves as living in 'Christian' nations, as a middle players on the world stage the drive to uphold values, freedom and morality takes different form."

I think you hit the nail on the head. Were the US much more secular, and devout folks had little chance of having an impact, then American evaneglicals and conservative Catholics would likely be a lot less political. In the rest of the Anglosphere (with the possible exception of Ireland and Australia), that "theocon" bloc is much smaller; without the ability to make political change, politics becomes a smaller priority.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;We don&#8217;t think of ourselves as living in &#8216;Christian&#8217; nations, as a middle players on the world stage the drive to uphold values, freedom and morality takes different form.&#8221;</p>
<p>I think you hit the nail on the head. Were the US much more secular, and devout folks had little chance of having an impact, then American evaneglicals and conservative Catholics would likely be a lot less political. In the rest of the Anglosphere (with the possible exception of Ireland and Australia), that &#8220;theocon&#8221; bloc is much smaller; without the ability to make political change, politics becomes a smaller priority.</p>
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