I owe Mark Byron a thank you. A few weeks ago he picked up on a Canadian charismatic holding meetings at his old stomping grounds in Florida. He posted again as 32 year old Todd Bentley of Fresh Fire Ministries started getting puff pieces by charismatic media, traditional media and websites in the US. Mark warns against being too gullible or being to harsh. Good advice.
There has been only a couple news articles from Canada about Todd Bentley and Florida.
That is not because a self proclaimed prophet is without honour in his own country, it has more to do with the insular nature of his belief system, and the exposure his brand of teaching has had to the wider church. He is known and his teaching rejected by most people of faith in his home province of BC, people who have certainly seen the effects of neo-pentecostalism.
When The Province asked to speak to someone who had been healed through Bentley in either B.C. or Florida, Fresh Fire was unable to find someone at short notice, citing difficulties with outdated contact information locally, and record-keeping problems in Florida.
I didn’t get a call back when I asked for their Revenue Canada registration.
I did get the information from Revenue Canada however.
April 24, 2008 Lakeside Leader
So immediate and complete was his conversion that within six months of his being discovered in Abbotsford, BC Christian circles, Todd Bentley was chosen to head up the newly formed ‘Fresh Fires Ministries.’ In just 10 short years, the church has grown astronomically, and does its work all over the world, from Africa and Korea to New Zealand and Mexico.
Bentley’s presence and delivery may be a sign of the times, but the Fresh Fire Minister’s message has the hallmarks of a traditional evangelist.
As regular readers know I post at connexions in Wales when I want safety in community when making personal spiritual observations or when I wish to rant about a particularly egregious matter.
Richard Hall also picked up on Fresh Fire Ministries and the Todd Bentley meetings in Lakeland Florida because they are being broadcast on GodTV (the equivalent of The Miracle Channel in Canada) Bentley intends to head to the UK this summer, GodTV is a good way to advertise, and given the money that can be taken, quite happy too.
This 25 minute video Richard posted with Bob Jones, Todd Bentley and Patricia Jones got us regular commenters playful in the comment section, but make no mistake, we take deception seriously.
When you see Satan being an angel of light, when you see New Age teachings tossed out as being from God, when you say demonic manifestation is okay or normal or God uses it anyway, when you see false prophecy and when you see so many people park their thinking at the door because of their need, sometime laughter is a healthy weapon.
The reaction to his posts was about as expected.
Something happened that has not happened to me before.
While I refrained from a blog post about this Canadian export ‘ministering’ in the US at connexions or BDBO, I certainly didn’t hold back on comments at connexions.
I’ve followed many of these movements for years and I am deeply grieved and irritated a Canadian is hoodwinking US neighbours. Again.
I’m no expert, I’m just an evangelical that hates to see people conned. I’ve received two emails today from people also following this resurgence of ‘revival’ that cycles every few years in neo-pentecostal circles. They picked up on the comments at connexions and took the time to email me at BDBO.
I’m genuinely grieved by this bold resurfacing of Apostolic/Third Wave/Latter Rain teaching, and frankly some of the blasphemy affects me spiritually and I have to guard against that.
At connexions I am surrounded by mature Christians and whether we agree or disagree there is respect and love. This is from Beth:
Hey!
Just read your response to the Todd Bentley stuff on here. It was very well written. I am struggling w/ this as well and have read alot of stuff from the freshfire website. I know that you said there were alot of new age, etc. teachings on there. Could you point me to some of those, maybe w/ dates or places you found that stuff? I ‘d really like to read it. Thank you so much. You have a great day.
I can try, and you have a great day too Beth.:^)
I believe when we examine claims we need to know how to proceed, so I’m happy to start pointing.
We look at more than one source. We look at the history of the movement. We look at the people in the movement, their conduct and words and ambitions and results. We look at transparency and finances. We look at outreach. And most of all when we look we have an obligation to weigh the evidence through scripture and in prayer. We wade through dreck to find gems.
There is no easy answer.
I use the New Age Encyclopedia, a concordance and bible as well as online information. I take notes when I watch a video or show and stack the words up against past claims. I rely on people who have good analytical skills and the gift of discernment. Discernment can be learned, although I believe there are times it is given as a gift in spiritually dangerous situations because God loves us. I look for people that have walked away from a cult, sect or movement, I think what they have to say is important. I look for sociological and none interested party observations. Noisy news coverage doesn’t translate to spiritual healthiness or truth.
I rarely share my spiritual journey online but I’m going to tell you part of an experience. A group of us from various denominations worked in a street ministry. One day we got a call from a landlord who was concerned about one of his tenants. She was in the last stages of alcoholism and although he wasn’t a religious man, he needed help and decided to call us. We went over. She was in bad shape and the first decision was to call an ambulance. As we began to do that, she seized, came too, jumped off the couch, pointed at me and screamed,” You love Jesus! You belong to Jesus!”
Okay.
I do.
It was not her speaking.
Satan knows Jesus better than I do, so when I hear of things in Jesus name I ask the following.
When something out of the ordinary (miracles, manifestations and revivals are claimed) where can they come from?
1) God
2) Satan
3) psychological/human need and ability
4) a mix of the above
Crossword is a site started by Trish Tillen in the UK. She was involved in the beginnings of extreme pentecostalism and although her work is done and she has moved on, it is an excellent resource for the pentecostal/charismatic deviations we continue to see. Latter Rain. Third Wave. Kansas City Prophets etc.
The site is deteriorating and you’ll get into monkey locks if you use the news section. Stick to the extensive article archive, the people that preserved it mean well and probably don’t have the financial resources to keep it as it was.
The Apologetics Index. Anton Hein is a remarkable apologist whom I’ve had the pleasure of corresponding with. He is full of grace and patience, has strong loving boundaries, knows the word of God and has studied sociological and religious cults for years. He started his on-line data base long before most of us were online. He gives readers tools to study movements, and presents all sides, respectfully presenting his own observations as a follower of Jesus Christ while honouring the readers need to find their own mind.
I suggest you start with a ‘how’ section on definitions of cults, heresy, judging versus discernment. There is nothing new about Bentley or anything he believes. Read up on Gnosticism. Look at the New Age movement. It took me two years to go through this data base, it is that extensive. It was like taking a theology course or reading the New Age Encyclopedia cover to cover.
Religious Tolerance is also a resource, neutral and necessary I think, to keep strong emotions in check when anger and grief or confusion at seeing people sucked in takes over.
There are new sites springing up all the time. One that I’ve found useful in following Todd Bentley is written by a pentecostal who knows the players and does extensive research. I don’t think she intended the deluge of traffic the site is getting, but she has an acute awareness of peoples need, curiousity and hunger for truth that she weighs against our calling as Christians to ‘test the spirits.’ There is no search engine, you’ll have to dig.
This will get you started.
Here is the apologetics index entry on Todd Bentley. Jump off it.
God be with you on your journey Beth.
I welcome any links that will help people being tossed to and fro by the latest manufactured hyper-charismatic revival circuit.
The second email came from Katrin in Germany.
Found your blogg entry this morning about Todd Bentley and the Florida outpouring. I’m a baptist and therefore not under carismatic suspicion I hope.
I have been watching the lakeland revival several nights with careful attention to all the most likely carismatic klischees and found myself conficted of false pride and a intellectual christian hybris. What do we expect revival to look like? What do we a revivalist expect to look like?
Let’s see the fruits it brings fourth and trust that god is in control. Do you believe that we are living in the advanced end times? Do you believe that god wants to gather his people to reach as much people as possible? Jesus told us to look at the fruits?
Watching the meetings I can see a Todd Bentley constantly pointing on Jesus and that not just in a “mantra style”. He makes Jesus the leader of the revival, not himself, I have a much better understanding of our great savior, his mercy, his humbleness, yes AND his power. Watching the meetings with a certain preconception of course you see him shouting and doing things “decent” cristians would’nt do or say but can we be so sure we would have liked the style of John the Baptist. I could go on that way knowing that all will not really convince you.
I pray that Jesus himself in sober and loving way will convince of his love and of the work he is actually doing through Todd Bentley (a most humble vessel I admit). Maybe you have been hurt in the past by carismatic christians or you are hurting in some other way that makes you so bitter about the carismatic movement. Note I am not a carismatic in the classical way, but I am a carismatic when it comes to yearn for revival, for fresh water on dry ground for gods touch and healing to a world that is dying. God is more than our preconceptions and Jesus just then surprised his disciples by acting and preaching always different to what people aspected him to. So why should this be different now… Be blessed Bene D
Yours Katrin. Please Bene D don’t miss what God is doing
Indeed Katrin, to miss what God is doing would be sad. Thank you, be blessed also. I’ve not been hurt by charismatics, I’m skeptical, but I’m not a cessationist. As for end times eschatology, I believe we are to live our life as if each day is our last, I don’t know when the end times are going to be. I’m here now, and God is on His throne.
Speaking up is not about denomination, it is not about style, it is not about varied personalities or worship differences. It is not about behaving like the assistant Holy Spirit. It is about being a Berean. It is about warning.
The more attention we give heresy, the more vulnerable people can be deluded and I don’t think Todd Bentley and his buddies need to be given the attention they crave.
Do I yearn for revival? Yes, but it doesn’t come manufactured. It doesn’t come because I long for it. I’m not unique, I think that is why we see so many counterfeits. I can be fooled, any one of us can, make no mistake about that. Revival starts with repentance and unless there is evidence of repentance a red flag should go up. Martyn Lloyd-Jones gives the characteristics of true revival. Jewel van der Mewre, this is what Bentley’s revival looks like:
THE NEW REVIVAL CHARACTERISTICS
1. It is a revival of the prophets that use the Holy Scriptures deceitfully.
2. It is a revival of “sorcery” (the magic art of manipulating people). People are being manipulated, sometimes by fear and other times by sheer deception, into blindly receiving unscriptural views.
3. It is a revival that wants to see the walls of the Churches and Denominations crumble and come under the authority, structure and network of the NEW BREED.
4. It is a revival of a NEW BREED that discriminates against Israel and the part of the Church that doesn’t go along with their teaching.
5. It is a revival that rejects the literal Rapture of the Church.
6. It is a revival that rejects SOUND DOCTRINE as a basis for unity.
7. It is a revival that teaches that it is wrong to judge the prophets according to the Word of God.
8. It is a revival that says that the Church (corporately) is the literal presence of Christ, so don’t look for another.
9. It is a revival that says, “Touch not God’s anointed.” The interpretation being: No matter what is said or how wrong it is, do not question. Christians dare not question or criticize the unscriptural utterances and practices of the prophets, for if they do, they are judged worthy of punishment.
10. It is a revival obsessed with a NEW BREED of people and a political agenda on earth.
11. It is a revival bent on turning the youth into a militant people with a war-like mentality designed to take dominion of the world and if need be - by force.
12. This new revival owes its character to a group of specific persons who are misinterpreting the Bible, and like the cults, supplementing it with their own dreams, visions and mystic ideas. Christian, if you fall for their doctrine, you are perfectly set up for deception. Be careful you are not swept off your feet into the great deception - the lie!
Over at connexions I suggested my Methodist minister friends take in a meeting. Ivan in Lakeland and Methodist Preacher, Fat Prophet and Methodist Preacher.
Their responses don’t surprise me, these are mature believers and their ears don’t tickle easily. UK - Bored of Outpouring
US - Strange Fire in Florida
Global Harvest Church - An account from Todd Bentleys home church.
A Toronto minister speaks out on his experience in The Toronto Blessing (Bentley is endorsed by the TB and John Arnott went to Lakeland to do so)
US - A warning from the editor of Charisma magazine
Other post: God TV
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YOU ARE BLINDED BY LIES, DECEPTIONS AND YOUR FLESH IF YOU BELIEVE WHAT TODD BENTLEY AND HIS HERETICS ARE DOING IS OF GOD. THERE HAVE BEEN THOUSANDS OF FALSE PROPHETS AND HERETICS IN HISTORY LEADING PEOPLE INTO DOCTRINES OF DEVILS AND BLASPHEMIES, TODD BENTLEY IS NO DIFFERENT AND WILL FALL UNDER THE JUDGMENT OF GOD IF HE DOES NOT REPENT AND PUBLICLY DENOUNCE HIS SATANIC DOCTRINES AND DECEPTIONS. YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED. RETURN TO THE HOLY BIBLE AND ITS SOUND DOCTRINES OR YOU WILL FALL WITH ALL THESE HERETICS WHO ARE THE ENEMIES OF GOD SERVING ANOTHER GOSPEL LEADING OTHERS INTO DESTRUCTION.
Jer 14:14 Then the LORD said unto me, The prophets prophesy lies in my name: I sent them not, neither have I commanded them, neither spake unto them: they prophesy unto you a false vision and divination, and a thing of nought, and the deceit of their heart.
Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
Mat 24:11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
Mat 24:24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if [it were] possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
Mar 13:22 For false Christs and false prophets shall rise, and shall shew signs and wonders, to seduce, if [it were] possible, even the elect.
Luk 6:26 Woe unto you, when all men shall speak well of you! for so did their fathers to the false prophets.
2Pe 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies
1Jo 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
1Ti 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils
1Ti 4:16 Take heed unto thyself, and unto the doctrine; continue in them: for in doing this thou shalt both save thyself, and them that hear thee.
2Ti 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine. For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;And they shall turn away [their] ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.
Tts 2:1 But speak thou the things which become sound doctrine:
Tts 1:10 For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers….Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, for filthy lucre’s sake.
Tts 1:16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny [him], being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.
Rom 16:18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.
Eph 5:6 Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.
2Cr 11:13 For such [are] false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light. Therefore [it is] no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness
PASTE ALL OF THESE QUOTES IN TODD BENTLEY’s CHAT TO WARN THE DECEIVED OF THE WORD OF GOD THROUGH THE BIBLE, PERHAPS A FEW WILL HAVE EARS TO HEAR AND REPENT OF TODD BENTLEY’s BLASPHEMIES. HIS HEALINGS AND MIRACLES ARE ALL A LIE AND TODD COULD NOT SHOW ANY PROOF OF HEALING OF ANYTHING EVEN REMOTELY RELATED TO A BIBLICAL EXAMPLE OF A HEALING IF HE WAS PUT TO ANY KIND OF SCIENTIFIC TEST. EVEN JESUS HIMSELF WHEN HE HEALED SOMEONE TOLD HIM AFTERWARDS TO GO TO THE PRIEST TO PROVE WHAT HAD BEEN DONE SO THAT THERE MAY BE WITNESSES. TODD IS ONLY AFTER YOUR MONEY AS MOST ALL TV PREACHERS ARE AND LEECHES OFF YOUR DESPERATION AND THE MADNESS OF VARIOUS PENTECOSTAL FALSE GOSPELS, IF YOU ONLY KNEW WHAT WAS INSIDE THE MINDS OF THESE HERETICS AND THEIR TRUE INTENTIONS YOU WOULD BE SHOCKED. THERE ARE SOME GOOD DOCUMENTARIES OUT THERE EXPOSING SOME OF THESE GUYS ON FILM SUCH AS “the great apostasy the last sign” from cultlink.
All you fellow Christians who believe in the sound doctrines of the Bible and who know video stuff should produce your own documentaries as well.
The mouths of these deceivers must be stopped.
I forgot to tell you, if you post ANY bible verse such as the ones above, or post any warning in the chat room and stay in it longer then 3 seconds after you post it, you will be permanently banned and have to get a vpn or other proxy in order to enter the chat room again, so when pasting verses or warnings, paste, then immediately leave and come back in 5 minutes, then it will be harder for Todd’s Bible denying heretic chatroom overlords to get a hold of your ip.
Observer - this cut and paste is getting dreary.
Thanks for dropping by. But please don’t shout. There’s no need.
I would not recommend Apologetics Index (Anton Hein) for without a strong caveat. Mr. Hein is a convicted child sex abuser in the state of California, USA. He is currently resident in the Netherlands and cannot return to the USA without being arrested for violating the terms of his probation.
http://www.cultnews.com/archives/000829.html
Hi Mirele:
You are referring to this information, which has been up for years.
http://www.apologeticsindex.org/faq2.html
As has what you’ve linked from Rick Ross.
http://www.apologeticsindex.org/about02.html
Hi;
Seceral people from my church are going to the Lakeland meetings. I was not invited to go. I will let you know what they say. I believe That Jesus looks at our step of faith for healing no matter where we go. As Vernon McGhee said “I believe in healing, but I don’t believe in healers”
God bless you,
Doug
Hi Doug:
That would be appreciated, thanks.
Revivalist Todd Bentley Loves and Supports Sexual Perverts
Any revival that has the involvement of sexual perverts, such as Paul Cain and Bob Jones, is from the pits of hell and not from God! These liars, deceivers and conartists at the Lakeland Revival, including Todd Bentley and Stephen Strader, only see and hear what they want to see and hear and that is so dumb because others are not dumb like they are! They see the truth about this so called revival is nothing but a farce and a joke devoid of integrity no matter how many people they might deceive! Walter Kambulow http://lionsmouth.tripod.com/todd.pdf
Todd Bentley’s (Fresh Fire Ministries) Revenue Canada Tax disclosure
http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/ebci/haip/srch/sec/SrchInput04Render-e?
bn=880636428RR0001&name=FRESH FIRE MINISTRIES
Thanks Rose.
I am interested in the whole subject of is this God or not. But I find non-arguments like that posted above by Observer to be unhelpful in the extreme.
It seems like the Christian world is currently mostly full of opinions and lacking in solid background research before coming to a prayerful and reasoned conclusion.
For example, has anybody actually researched where Todd’s money is going. I hear that it is doing a lot of good work around the world.
God help us all. I don’t know who to be afraid of most, the deceivers or anti-deceivers.
Todd Bentley’s “classes” via DVD are being offered at my church. I was saved from a world of occultism and it frightens me that so many of the mannerisms are the same. The spasmodic head jerkings and falling into trance like states with moanings that scare the children. We are at the point where if you are not “in” you are “out”. I don’t want to lose my church. I am afraid for my brothers and sisters. I am going to speak out at this fridays class. Pray for me.
Once again, “God is offending the mind to reveal the heart.” I have traveled the world for 40 years, preaching a Gospel of the Kingdom that includes signs and wonders. I come home to my nation and realize why most of the rest of the world is in revival, and people are leaving churches by the thousands each week in the U.S.
With most pastors and theologians living under the wicked influence of an “anti-supernatural worldview,” the rational thinking, principle preaching church of America continues to preach without power.
If so called experts would simply leave what they don’t understand alone and use the Gamaliel test of Acts, we would know what is of God and what is not.
Let God decide, and give people enough credit that thy can discern what is of God and what is not!
I have met Todd Bentley and at first I was taken back a step. Yet you must look into the spirit and motive of his heart and not judge by what you see. I have been against every so called move of God in these revivals and even now I am not blind to things. Yet I tell you the truth this man prayed for me one night and I was healed and changed and my life will never be the same and I give God all the Glory. I have a fresh fire for Jesus like never before.
Check out my web-site and blog me your issues and maybe I can help you understand where this man and movement is coming from. If this is not God it will die out but if it is God do you really want to miss it. Think about it. China earthquake, our crazy election, the economy, the sin in our young people. What if this is an end time revival, do you want to be like the Pharisees and miss Jesus.
Shirley, sadly mostly churched people get sucked in - pray for them, educate yourself, warn them and if they don’t hear, you may have to walk away.
The Kansas City Prophets want division, (blue coats, grey coats) get yourself up to speed historically, sociologically and spiritually. Grief is a healthy spiritual response when we see people deceived again, I’m sorry your friends are so unaware, go under the mercy.
My take on this guy, and this “movement”. I am a new Christian, a little over a year. I had never even heard about this stuff until last month when the Lord showed me that the “counselor” I was going to at my church was absolutely steeped in this stuff, “gold fillings”, “gray hair turning back to brown”, “sapphire angel dust”, “precious gems”, you get the picture. Also what I didn’t know was, although she never directly talked to me about this stuff during my counseling, she was slipping it in under the radar for about four months. She even had me convinced that demons were having sex with me, and I believed it!!! My point? This stuff is dangerous!!
Although I’m a pretty new Christian, I thank God, and am still learning how to pronounce the books of the bible, one thing I do know about is the occult because I was steeped in the culture for about 30 years in Los Angeles. Sooo, first time I saw Todd Bentley was about three weeks ago, and WOW, I was back in the world of the occult! I recognized what this was immediately! He has all the moves down pat. Then the Lord pointed me to a guy named Rodney Howard-Browne and his “laughing” revival. I felt sick in my soul. Then the Lord directed me to the “Elijah List”, and I felt like crying. Ladies and Gentlemen, this stuff is not from God. Please listen to me, I KNOW the occult, and this is not God or his Holy Spirit. I could tell you all about hypnotism, psychic readings, angel worship, astro-projection, channeling, on and on, and what these guys are doing and saying is occult. And, I can recognize Satan too (although I couldn’t for those years I was involved in it). What I saw in Todd Bentley, and Rodney Howard-Browne was Satan! Look in their eyes! If that doesn’t work for you, just turn the sound off and then watch them. These guys, and those that are “prophets” on the Elijah List are dangerous. And if you don’t believe me, then believe the Lord because He is the one who revealed them, and my used-to-be-counselor to me, told me “to stay away from it”, and to warn others. I’m still reeling from this revelationl, and I’m still researching them and warning others. May God bless all those who are being led away from Him!
I like what Maggie Dawn had to say:
“One of the most troubling aspects of these revivals, though, is when they are overlaid with promises of material gain, and under the guise of faith, people start counting on the revival as a down-payment for a lottery win. As others have noted, focusing on a “bless ME” kind of Christianity particularly sticks in the throat in a month where two massive natural disasters have left hundreds of communities bereaved and materially devastated.”
May I just point out a couple of things. Firstly, the Lakeland Outpouring has now had 12 documented, verified cases of people being raised from the dead, including a three year old who was dead for forty eight hours, and is now fine. Satan, as far as I know, cannot give life. He comes to steal, kill and destroy. People have attested to creative miracles. Again, Satan is incapable of creation. Please consider this.
Secondly, I too came from a background of being steeped in the occult, and can discern an occult spirit pretty reliably. Satan is very good at counterfeit. The manifestations you see in Florida are the true expression of the Holy Spirit that Satan has accurately counterfeited and convinced people that they can only be found in occultism. I have now been a Christian for 25 years and seen just about every expression of Christianity there is, and I am convinced that Todd Bentley is no false prophet. In fact I have never heard him actually claim to be a prophet. Paul Cain, incidentally was withdrawn from the platform after his recent appearance and controversial comments regarding his past. Christian leaders are capable of mistakes, and Todd Bentley took action as soon as he saw his.
My husband I have been watching the Florida Outpouring for three weeks, and so far we have found a peace in our marriage we have never had before, a hunger for God like never before, my husband’s recovery from Chronic Fatigue Syndrome is accelerating, and I have come under conviction of sin in my life and have a worship for God like never before. This is something the enemy cannot produce. He will not do something that increases people’s love and devotion to God.
We have friends who have just returned from Florida; the change is amazing. They exhibit love and every fruit of the Spirit there is.
When the Toronto Blessing appeared I was convinced it couldn’t be from God for most of the same reasons you doubt this present move of God. I went myself to see first hand, and it was the changed lives and changed attitudes of my fellow Christians which convinced me it was genuine. I now have friends among Toronto Airport Christian Fellowship, and the thing that impacts me about them is their amazing attitude of love and grace and hunger for holiness. “By their fruit you shall know them”. Before you condemn the leaders of the Florida Outpouring , examine their fruit and then make your decision.
Be Blessed.
Great message Y Mason.
He loves us, oh, how he loves us.
Some people will have issues with this because they have a hard heart which isn’t able to humble themself because of their own insecurity in the Lord.
YES our God is an alive God, and YES, he heales today. If this revival healing isn’t from him then what is?
youtube.com/watch?v=JoC1ec-lYqs
Pardon?
No one said God is not alive. No one said God doesn’t heal. You don’t know about the Latter Rain claims? You don’t know the New Age cross-over? You don’t know about the rampent unconfessed sin which has been going on for years in these leaders lives? You don’t know about dominionism teaching? Your question is excellent.
What is of God?
Answer us from scripture using comparative analysis of Bentley’s words. BD
If 12 people were raised from the dead - this would be bigger news than someone being dug out alive from the rubble of the China earthquake after 172 hours.
If it were true it would make every wire service in the world.
If one were raised from the dead it would make world news.
These claims are not new, and no matter what televangelist, priest or sorcerer makes them, they are not new and they cross all world religions. Richard Bonnke was proven a liar, Hinn, now Bentley.
We do know people have died at some of these healing crusades, a Canadian Catholic priest who claimed healing power is an example. Several people died at a recent service of his in the Philippines.
Jim Jones preached Jesus. David Koresh preached Jesus.
The dead being raised has been ‘reported’ in 125 countries in the past couple of years. Not one has been found true.
‘How can this not be of God’ a not a new question.
Shamatic practises, lies, scamming - Bentley isn’t new, he has been well weighed and found wanting by many experienced charismatics who experienced Toronto, Brampton, Brownsville. Sun Myung Moon, Lord Maitreya (through Benjamin Creme) spiritualists, Angus Buchan. The list is long. These claims are not new.
Lourdes which has been a healing centre for 150, visited by 5 million people a year - 65 healings have been verified by strict criteria. 19 since 1947. No one has been raised from the dead.
I believe you are sincere. I also believe you are sincerely wrong. I do not take your word for it. I’ve seen some of the more outlandish (but common charismatic) claims being erased from Fresh Fire Ministries. Think about it. Bentley openly claims the mantle of William Branham. He openly takes the dominionist claim of ‘New Apostle.’ As have Cain, Bickle, Howard-Browne, Jones, Joyner etc.
Bentley has openly claimed his mother died so he could have the anointing - http://endtimespropheticwords.wordpress.com/category/fresh-fire-ministries-todd-bentley/
We know what lies have been condoned in this latest wave, what sin has been overlooked, what deceptions are being used, what lies have been told, what false and dangerous teaching has been tossed out, what cover ups are going on, what ‘angel spirits’ are claimed.
You can see a plant in at least one of his videos, this is not new.
May your Jesus be the Messiah the Son of the Living God, may your repentance be complete before a Holy God and bring wisdom and discernment and when the hard times come may the cross be your sufficiency.
Who is your God? Who is your Jesus? Whom are you serving, worshipping and idolizing?
Why would you believe much of the phenoneman is even spiritual?
Will God be merciful to some of the needy, desperate, gullible and naive being deceived in this heretical latest wave?
Yes.
So please let me ask you this:
What verification criteria for dead being raised is a considered a requirement for you?
I feel sorry for those of you who claim Todd as a false prophet. It’s so obvious this is not the work of Satan. He does not claim any of this as his own work - he gives praise to Jesus and is rewarded with the Holy Spirit leading him, telling him what to say and do. Is it his tattoos or his testimony that puts you off? WOuld you rather it be someone in a suit doing the good work? I never knew how to accept Jesus into my heart before this revival and feel blessed to be able to see this revival that has touched me deeply and I have begun to turn to the bible which I never did before.
Open your hearts - who are you to judge others? God will judge righteously when the time comes. If you are so against the revival, I advise you to turn away, but it will be turning away from God’s message. Do you really want to miss out on this?
Love and peace to you all.
Dear brother Bene D. It never takes me by surprise how people react to teachings that are a not like what they are used to! It is sad and very depressing. The whole world of christianity is constantly at each others throats. The rest of the world looks at us and laughs at us because we can not even get along with each other. Would we even pray for someone that we think is a fake! Would we pray that GOD ALL MIGHTY would bring them into his will!! Not ours!! but HIS WILL. We humans think we can figure out what God is all about and who lines up and who does not, Are we really all that brilliant? I do not think so!! because if we were then there would not be such a high rate of crime, greed, divorce,child abuse,elderly abuse,war,hate,narrow mindedness,the list goes on and on and on!!! I am humble enough to put myself in these catigories also. You do not know for sure that Todd Bently and his staff are frauds!! You can not look into his heart and know what is there for SURE!!! You can diesect his sermons and take little misquotes and turn against him to HOODWINK THE WORLD INTO THINKING HE IS TAKING THEM FOR EVERY DOLLAR HE CAN!!! But you really can not prove any of your accusations!! I really do pray that christians will learn to pray for each other and that we will one day really be apart from the world and their ways!! But right now I fear that we are a lot like the PHARISEES!!! Jesus could not perform any miracles in his own home town, because of unbelief. Sounds a little familiar does it not. I am not an educated man like yourself, But I am at least ready to listen and look and try to find good in what this man is trying to do. He holds Jesus at the Helm and is at least trying to accomplish what many of us are afraid to do. THAT IS BELIEVE WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS!! And go out and take it to the masses and see what God will do. Did not the apostles do the same!!! Did not Christ himself direct us to expand the kingdom? Did not Christ Die on a cross Because of Jeliousily?? Disbelief, He Stated that he was the son of God, They did nod believe. They Tortured him , Crucified him, spat on him, through doubt opon him, .We all should look at Colossians 2:8 Beware, lest any man spoilyou through philosophy and vain deceit, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. The finger pointed at Todd Bently is yours ,but under that finger is 3 more pointing at you. You are also getting a lot of attention, and connections with people and organizations, Maybe payment also? Just a Question? I cant prove it . But it might be possible!! The point to all of this is see how words can be twisted. Laywers make a very good living at that . So do writers, and politicians!! Look at the mess we have in the good ole USA. Washinhton is full of people very capible of destruying another with words and just plant doubt. May God have mercy on us all
Sonia - No one commented on Todd’s appearance, there are videos online prior to his tatooing and heart attack.
I believe the answers you seek are in the bible.
Okay Gary do you feel better? If you are not ready to weigh the words and outcome of the Kansas City Prophets against scripture, that’s fine.
This isn’t the USA, this is Canada, there are many who have known Bentley, King et all for quite awhile.
When you are ready there are many mature and loving followers of Jesus Christ from all over the world who have left this movement who are telling their stories.
Fresh Fire Ministries is not allowing questions on their sites or affiliated sites.
They are re-working web page content many faithful charismatics are objecting to.
You can check current content against cache and The Wayback Machine.
I believe there are many people eager to grow in the grace and knowledge of the Lord Jesus Christ who have sincere questions and desires.
BDBO can only point readers to resources, I’m not prepared or equipped to get into circular discussions with Toddsworld inhabitants.
This is an established and well documented movement with a goal to divide.
The roots of the tree are rotten and I will not feed division, immaturity, hyper-spiritual confusion nor permit this blog to be a billboard for Bentley fans.
You are where you are and each one of us has to turn our own page.
God be merciful to me, a sinner.
The Lord bless you and keep you;
The Lord make His face shine upon you, And be gracious to you;
The Lord lift up His countenance upon you, And give you peace.
Amen and amen.
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