A Court of Queen’s Bench judge has ruled an anti-gay letter written by a former Alberta pastor in 2002 was not a hate crime and is allowed under freedom of speech.
Justice E.C. Wilson overturned a 2008 ruling by the Alberta Human Rights Commission that the letter by Stephen Boissoin that was published in the Red Deer Advocate broke provincial law.
At the time, the commission said it may even have played a role in the beating of a gay teenager two weeks after it was published.
The commission had ordered Boissoin to refrain from making disparaging remarks about homosexuals and to pay the complainant, former Red Deer high school teacher Darren Lund, $5,000 in damages.
Neither order can now be enforced, as Wilson declared them “unlawful or unconstitutional.”
Boissoin has been used as an example for US religious right groups against homosexuality, bu calling him a pastor and saying he’s been imprisoned etc. The US Alliance Defense Fund intervened in his hearing. Boissoin responded to US support here. He solicited funds to pay for what he said would be a fight to the Supreme Court of Canada.
Thursday’s judgment by Court of Queen’s Bench Justice Earl Wilson overturned a December 2007 ruling by a human rights panel, chaired by Lethbridge lawyer Lori Andreachuk.
Wilson ruled Andreachuk made many errors in her ruling and that her order for Boissoin to pay Lund $5,000 and to refrain from making “disparaging remarks” about gays was illegal and unenforceable.
The development marks another step in a saga that has lasted more than seven years and included a lawsuit and death threats against Lund, who is married with two children
Boissoin said, for him, the matter is now resolved.
Boissoin now works in the housing industry.
Published 3 months, 1 week ago 88 comments88 Responses to “Stephen Boissoin -Alberta Human Rights Commission ruling overturned”
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I don’t even know where to start with commenting on this. As a respector of human rights and freedoms, I still believe there are limits and feel this decision is completely inappropriate.
Sometimes there is a fine line between freedom of religion/speech and statements that incite hatred towards individuals and groups.
I have read Boissoin’s letter and to me, he is one poorly sick man who probably shouldn’t be a professing Christian. Through his letter, he has admitted his god is incapable and weak. There is a quote from a friend of mine that comes to mind here. That is, “There has never been a law written that has changed the heart of a person”. You cannot legislate morality, nor can you force others to to see things in the same moral context as you do. I would never allow a man with his convictions and more-so, his fears, to represent my moral beliefs. Having been a Christian, worship leader and born again, spirit filled, speaking in tongues Pastor, it’s because of heretics like this guy that I began to question whether god even existed. How could a god, so loving and forgiving, allow such hatred from the lips of one of his own? Jesus never condemned the world or those in it, His intolerance was toward the “religious leaders” who claimed to be representatives of god, imposing their own ideas and legalisms of righteousness and morality, that continued to be involved in “religious activities” only to accomplish their own agenda based on their selfishness and narrow-minded misconceptions from “their” personal interpretation of the “Word of God”, twisting it to their own benefit.
Enough about that… the letter from Boissoin is here: http://canadianpastor.blogspot.com/
I encourage you to read Biossoin’s letter and then head on over to wikiquote to read similar statements from someone a little better known; “Parallel to the training of the body a struggle against the poisoning of the soul must begin. Our whole public life today is like a hothouse for sexual ideas and simulations. Just look at the bill of fare served up in our movies, vaudeville and theaters, and you will hardly be able to deny that this is not the right kind of food, particularly for the youth … Theater, art, literature, cinema, press, posters, and window displays must be cleansed of all manifestations of our rotting world and placed in the service of a moral, political, and cultural idea.” Adolph Hitler, Mein Kampf, 1925. http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Mein_Kampf and for a good essay of Hitler’s religion, quite similar to the “religion” of today’s neo-cons, you can check out http://creationtheory.org/Essays/Hitler.xhtml
If it looks like a duck, acts like a duck, quacks like a duck, flies like a duck, well then it’s probably a duck!
Read Boissoin’s letter several times and then ask yourself, “does this man love as Jesus loved?”
For anyone who claims they support anyone who stands for morality in the name of god, I recommend reading the entire book of “Mein Kampf” as it will be quite an eye opener for you. For some other quotes from Hitler, many of which are used by today’s socially conservative religious right-wing(nuts), just google “hitler quotes” and another good place to start is http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/a/adolf_hitler.html
Sorry folks, but that kind of morality, I just don’t need and I think it’s quite a detriment for the Alberta Human Rights commission to have the ruling overturned by the Alberta Court of Queen’s Bench.
Let’s see, how many things can we look at historically, where a ruling like this would have been detrimental… Blacks would still be sold as slaves in North America, Jews would be on the run for fear of extermination, non-Roman Catholics would be lighting our gardens and pathways, those practicing alternate forms of spirituality would be burned at the stake, Indian Residential Schools would still exist and flourish and the list goes on.
A progressive society has no place for bigots like Boissoin and if we’re ever to move forward as a culture, people have to start accepting reality for what it is.
A book I highly recommend which is becoming ever-harder to find is called “Politics or Christ” by Rick Johnston. I used to recommend and sell this book back in my “Christian” days. I never thought I would recommend it again but if you believe you’re a Christian and you insist on remaining one, then this book is a must-read for you, especially if you support the legislation of morality or any moral movement in the name of Christ, for that matter. Since I’m no longer a Christian, I no longer can agree whole-heartedly with the book but I can’t argue any of the foundations on which it’s based. If you can’t find the book and really wish to read it, I still have several copies which I would b e willing to part with at a very modest price. You can contact me through the link associated with my name.
Sorry to dump on your blog like this Bene, but it’s garbage like this that gets my blood boiling!
I’m glad you spoke up Tim, I’ve had my dialogue with Steven Boission. It can be found by following the link.
Thanks for the link to the letter, it’s quite one thing to debate the right to speak freely, quite another to read how this was picked up and used for financial gain in the US.
It’s really something to read his letter, it’s a disgusting piece of self aggranditizing scapegoating.
The Red Deer Advocate letter is in the post but people will have to back track and that’s not likely unless they are really interested.
We are so unwilling to call out bigots, especially because they make so much noise, and because they get attention bullying and silencing, but the damage they do to public perception of evangelicals cannot be minimized.
Thanks for your book offer, I’ll be taking you up on that.
A human right is given by God and ordained by his majestic and benevolent power through and upon the souls of men .The state has no place nor yet even any right to enforce pro homosexual propaganda in the schools and advanced senstivity training that essentially makes the antithetical claim that gays have human rights which are morally superior to straight heterosexual people,who alone possess the power to sexually reproduce other humans. The Gay agenda is very cunning indeed, seeing that they seek to assert the pernicious claim that humans are merely evolved beings and that laws are hence arbitrary being relative. But that is not the case,but the opposite We have been created by God through JesusChrist- we can procreate,something which gsys cannot ever hope to do. Therefore their very (gay)rights are called into question as they should be. Stand against the wiles of the devil ephesians 6.When you follow Jesus you can impact people for the gospel not some orwellian social policy and love people with all your heart -but despise the evil policy….
The state has the responsibility of upholding human rights Timothy.
In this case Steven Boission’s right to speak was upheld by a provincial judicial branch.
On the federal level C-38 is not going to be repealed because it doesn’t suit your personal belief.
marriage is a God given relationship one man and one woman which is discriminate by its very nature.That is the foundation of the family which cannot be changed. There is no such thing as gay marriage in any way……….
Of course I roll my eyes at a large portion of what I read here. the author of this site has attacked me every opportunity he gets.
So, in saying that, I ask that you ask me what I think, who I am, what I feel and then base your opinion, your judgements on what I have said to you directly.
If you choose to honour me this way, I ask that you ask a couple brief questions at a time and I will gladly respond from my heart knowing that God is in the midst of us.
Would Christ give me any less opportunity?
http://catholiclight.stblogs.org/archives/2008/06/stephen-boissoi.html
Also, FYI:
[b]The good news.[/b]
The decision of Justice Earl Wilson of the Court of Queen’s Bench in Boissoin v Lund will have a significant long term positive impact on religious freedom in Canada:
1. The decision established a very high threshold for the conclusion that a publication is in violation of the “hate” provisions of Alberta’s human rights laws. The prosecutor, Dr. Lund, told the Canadian Press that “If the language contained in the letter does not meet the threshold of hateful, I am not certain what possibly would.” If Dr. Lund is right, then there will be no further prosecutions. The decision of the Alberta Human Rights Commission to withdraw from the case suggests that the Commission learned from Dr. Lund’s mistake. There is no place for thought control in a free and democratic society.
2. Dr. Lund told the Calgary Herald that the decision of Justice Wilson “takes away the tools at our disposal”. He is correct. The tools of censorship should not be available to prohibit freedom of expression in Canada. There is no circumstance in a free society where limitations on political or religious debate can be justified.
3. While the decision did not strike down Alberta’s “hate speech” laws, it significantly limited the application of such laws. Justice Wilson properly pointed out that a province may not duplicate the federal Criminal Code rules outlawing hate crime. Furthermore, Justice Wilson interpreted the provision in question as only prohibiting hateful words that lead to discriminatory activity under the provincial human rights legislation. Justice Wilson found that Stephen Boissoin’s letter to the editor was not hateful and did not cause discriminatory behaviour. It is difficult to conceive of a political or religious debate that would meet the two part test established in the legislation. Therefore, it is safe to conclude that in the future no religious or political debate will be found to be in breach of the current text of Alberta’s human rights laws.
Gerald Chipeur, QC
ps….Lund ws asked to prove via affidavit that he received “death threats” or any threats that warranted concern. After the AHRC Panel Chair investigated his claim and his corresponding request to have the public banned from the hearing, she ruled that there was no basis for his claim or request. She even invited him to offer evidence in the future based on his own claim to have evidence. It was never provided. It was a lie. Lund attempted to use every means to win and twist the facts.
I, in fact, have had my life threatened but just laughed it off and moved on.
I cannot judge your intent, but this site twists facts in a similair fashion.
Any victory for freedom of speech is great and the gays are hateful people
One of your other posts claims that “Boissoin is a member of an independent charismastic word/faith full gospel church named Life Church.”
I have never heard of this organization nor could my doctrinal position be defined as charismatic/full Gospel in the denominational sense.
Many claims on this site which refer to me, are innacurate and pose a strong bias against me.
Stephen, thank you for offering the opportunity to ask brief questions. I only have one and it’s quite brief:
What did Jesus say about homosexuality?
I trust your answer will not only be from your own heart but as a professing Christian, I expect it would be substantiated with undisputed Biblical evidence.
Thanks again for this opportunity and I look forward to your concise and conclusive response.
Tim,
Although those who purport that question/statement as if it is something wise, it is in fact laughable to anyone who has a decent understanding of who Jesus was and what he believed and taught.
Jesus was a Jew (obviously) who made it clear that he supported the Old Testament Law. I will provide one proof text here.
Matthew 5:17-20 17″Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. 20For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven.
Jesus was a teacher of the law and read from the OT scriptures on a regular basis. The OT scriptures condemned homosexuality and it is a given to any reputable biblical scholar that Jesus opposed this behaviour. His support for the OT is clear throughout scripture making your attempt at an argument without foundation to begin with.
In the above proof text, Jesus made it clear that the law (of His Father) was in full effect and that it (the Mosaic law with sacrificial and judicial applications) would remain so until the conclusion of the Old Covenant which in Hebrews 8:13 Paul explains (as does Jesus in other places) is soon to pass.
Jesus and the Apostles knew that the moral law was good and forever would be.
Blessings,
Stephen
Also, one could also make a strong case using reason and/or critical thinking simply by ascertaining that if Jesus thought that homosexuality was moral, he would have addressed the obvious injustices that the OT writ purported about it
The same could be said for the Apostles. Instead we see Paul maintain consistecy with the moral law in the OT in Romans and 1 Corinthians 6:9-11
9Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders 10nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. 11And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.
Take note of verse 11. Obviously, homosexuals were repenting and receiving forgiveness through Christ.
The same is expected of them today as it is for all of us.
John, I too am grateful for certain victories regarding freedom of speech. It provides me with the opportunity to express the fact that your attitude towards homosexuality is that of one who is uncompassionate and ignorant and to categorically state that all people who are not necessarily of your particular sexual persuasion are hateful only confirms that ignorance.
I don’t see things the way you do John. Does this make me hateful as well?
I’ll be honest, I am hateful. I hate stupidity and narrow-mindedness because they not only hinder the quest for ultimate truth and understanding, they prevent it. Being stupid and narrow-minded is a choice and sadly, it’s the option so many people choose and what’s worse is that those who choose to be that way expect the rest of us to live within the confines and consequences of their choice.
Hi Stephen:
“Boissoin is a member of an independent charismastic word/faith full gospel church named Life Church.”
Thank you for pointing this out.
http://tiny.cc/mSIg1
The post has been updated and amended with your correction.
That link from Life Church is no longer active, btw.
I have asked you about your ministerial credentials/ordination.
I’d like to try again.
Do you or did you ever hold a ministerial licence recognized by the province of Alberta?
Which denomination ordained you as a pastor/reverend?
“Many claims on this site which refer to me, are innacurate and pose a strong bias against me.”
If there are facts up at BDBO which need correction, please point them out and they will be promptly addressed.
Stephen, thank you for pointing out what Jesus didn’t say, but I asked what he DID say. I don’t care about what others, such as Paul had to say as it’s quite irrelevant and any astute biblical scholar will be able to point out the many inconsistencies and unreliability of Paul’s teachings. As a matter of fact, many scholars even question Paul’s sexual persuasion/preference.
You are a follower of Christ, so again, I ask, What DID Jesus specifically say about homosexuality?
In other words, show me the red letters please.
Why don’t people actually get the facts on this case. Read the legal brief submitted by Stephen Boissoin and the judges decision:
http://www.law.ualberta.ca/centres/ccs/uploads/Boissoin_QB.pdf
http://stephenboissoin.com/downloads/scan013_20091203_1804441.pdf
http://missmarprelate.blogspot.com/2009/12/boissoin-runling-quotes.html
Find out who Steve was and is. You will not find single bad word written about him by any one who actually knew him then or knows him now. And he was a well known youth worker at the time. He had given everything he had to helping troubled kids, including many gay kids. No one who knows him would accuse him of hurting a fly.
This case was based on the allegation that a gay teenager had been assulted because of the letter. There is no evidence this ever happened. No police report was ever filed. The alleged victim was never identified to the commission or the court. Someone??? took a teenager to the Red Deer Advocate to complain about the letter. Darren Lund, an anti-Christian activist, was a high school teacher in Red Deer at the time, who wanted to bring a United Church minister into the school to teach the kids that the Bible was wrong about homosexuality. Steve had every right to respond. He saw the evidence every day of the harm that promiscuity and lack of moral context regarding every kind of sexuality was having on kids. He had every moral and Charter right to respond to government policy in the public schools.
Steve’s letter may have been strongly worded and have offended some people, but Darren Lund could have responded by writing a letter himself, but instead, he went home crying and got Big Brother to come take the other kids lunch money. Probably in the range of $200,000 in expenses for Steve. And a ridiculous order from the “Human Rights” Tribunal that Steve pay $5000 to Lund, a non-victim for his whining and suffering and apologize to Lund publically for his deeply held religious beliefs. Even serial killers can not be ordered to do this (maybe in North Korea they can). Thankfully Judge Wilson did every thing but laugh out loud at this.
Darren Lund is a Hate Pimp. For this, many liberal organizations have richly rewarded him, including giving him an associate professorship at U of C.
Stephen Boissoin has been put through more than 7 years of hell for voicing very controversial opinions. Even if you hate Stephen’s words, how many of us have not done exactly that, even in writing. Read the letter now that it can actually be published freely. Every one of us should be grateful to Steve for not just giving in to this thug and PAYING HIM OFF like many who have been hauled before these evil Inquisitions have done, just to make it go away.
As for threats of violence against Lund; maybe someone in the media should ask what kind of threats Stephen got, like HIV loaded syringes. He just doesn’t whine about it and portray himself as a victim the way Lund does.
By the way, Stephen never compared people in consensual relationships to pedophiles. He was talking about radical activists in the public schools and NAMBLA.
Humans, whether individuals or governments, cross a dangerous line when they go beyond judging men’ evil deeds (we are called to judge right from wrong according to law), and start judging the motivations of a man’s heart (love or hate). That is God’s territory.
Tim,
It is apparent where you are heading. Are you ignorant enough to assume that you are introducing me to this for the first time? The thought of addressing it bores me as I am confident that you have no desire to heed the truth. You are simply being stubborn and avoiding the obvious. Jesus never mentioned beastiality, rape or incest either which are addressed in the Mosaic Law. Did he have no problem with these practices either? Have you ever studied the greek definition for Porneia? It is clear that homosexual was an abberant form of sexuality to Jesus and the Apostles but I am sure there is nothing that I could post here that would convince you.
As far as Christ’s word in red go, they are no more or less inspired than the ones in black.
Bene…this seems to be a very personal issue to you and I know that others have addressed it with you on sites where you have posted. How come it is such an important matter to you? I resigned as I have stated hundreds of times previously. Everyone simply remembers me as the Pastor/Reverend who I was at the time of the letter. Even the judge knew that I resigned.
Even though I know that your issue with this accomplishes nothing, I will still email you an actual scan of the license to solemnize marriages that I previously held. It has my government license # on it and you can even contact the government to verify that it was once in full effect, if you so desire. If it wasn’t, then there’s a few unregistered marriages out there…lol. You can’t get a license to solemnize marriages unless you are a marriage commissioner or a licensed clergy member….to be a clergy member you have to affiliate with a denomination that has been approved by the gov.
Blessings guys,
Stephen Boissoin
stephen what actually was the legal claim made against you, initially, that got you in trouble ? It seems to me that you were merely commenting on the socially engineered policies that we have legally established in our present day.The power of U.N. style political correctness being wHat it is has sought to turn society away from the truth of the holy sciptures ,slowly and incrementally in such a fashion (or fascism), that many do not recognize what absolute values even are.In addition, we are at the point where the majority of people who seem to get awarded human right judgements are the only people that cant seem to produce any -humans that is- hmm take care from ottawa TIMOTHY timothygill007(at)hotmail(dot)com EPHESIANS 5,6 marriage is a discriminate relationship one man and one woman in the LORD
Re: Lund claiming death threats via emails.
The following excerpt is taken from a ruling on the matter by then Panel Chair, Lori Andreachuk:
Issue 5
[46] There is no evidence that Dr. Lund has been harassed or that his family’s safety is in jeopardy. However, if Dr. Lund can submit such evidence to the Panel of a cogent nature, the Panel will do everything in its power to protect Dr. Lund and his family from any harassment or threats to their safety.
http://www.albertahumanrights.ab.ca/LundDarren050406Pa.pdf
Lund provided no further evidence but still went on to make these claims to the media on numerous occasions. The only threat we saw in the so called evidence he provided, was a warning that he was going to go to hell. It was a ploy to manipulate the Panel before the hearing and a consistent ploy used to manipulate the public.
Timothy,
In a nutshell, Lund’s complaint stated – discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation contrary to Section 3 of the Human Rights, Citizenship and Multiculturalism Act (“the Act”).
On Monday, June 17, 2002, the Red Deer Advocate Newspaper, published a letter to the editor entitled “Homosexual Agenda Wicked”, written by Mr. Stephen Boissoin, executive director, Concerned Christian Coalition Inc. (CCC). On July 22, 2002, Dr. Lund, a professor at the University of Calgary, filed a formal human rights complaint against Mr. Boissoin and the CCC. Dr. Lund complained that the letter contravened the Human Rights, Citizenship and Multiculturalism Act (2000) Section 3 on the grounds of sexual orientation and the area of Publications and Notices.
http://www.albertahumanrights.ab.ca/LundDarren113007Pa.pdf
Re: Comment Above
“He solicited funds to pay for what he said would be a fight to the Supreme Court of Canada.” Please provide source of my exact wording. How would I have any idea that we would go that far? Unless I submitted the quote in text, it was most likely a blunder by a reporter.
Who cares when this is in fact the truth. We are prepared to go this far if necessary and have been from the onset. Hopefully we won’t have to proceed any further.
Also, there was only one claim in 7.5 years that I had been imprisoned. It was corrected immediately.
Thanks
Hi Rose:
Are you being paid to cut and paste?
Your comment is up under Rose, rcmagpie etc., at sites permitting comments.
I agree people should read, background has been provided previously at BDBO.
Do you have a link the the 400 thousand dollar civil suit Stephen Boissoin filed against Darren Lund?
Stephen:
By all means, send a copy of your licence.
I keep asking because you seem to have trouble answering.
Justice Wilson did not address you as Reverend, former reverend or pastor in his ruling of course.
When I have raised the issue elsewhere online, you have chosen not to respond.
If you’ve stated it hundreds of times previously, why haven’t you corrected media, blogs and forums over the years calling you Reverend or Pastor Boissoin?
If I am understanding your previous comment correctly you were ordained by this denomination.
http://www.cmp-cpm.forces.gc.ca/pub/rc/rel/eccc-ecec-eng.asp and would have met the following criteria for ordination: http://www.cecconline.com/node/6
What bible school did you attend?
When were you licenced as Reverend Boissoin?
When did Alberta recognize your credentials?
When did you resign?
Thanks for you time, I take it there are no other facts in dispute here at BDBO.
timothy: I edited your email – took out @ and replaced it with (at).
Spam bots.
Stephen:
Here is what you previously said:
http://tinyurl.com/yl2qqmx
Boissoin: (A) Yes, I resigned as a licensed minister and parted ways with my denomination due to doctrinal issues mainly eschatological.
(B) I interned and went to Bible College in Calgary in 1993 & 94, interned and studied in England in 97 and through the my denominations affiliate school received a degree in Christian Ministry and commenced my Masters which I may or may not complete. Without doubt I have a passion for Theology, Apologetics and Philosophy.
(C) As far as I know I was the first ordained minister to be taken before the Human Rights Commission for propagating their religious views.
“If you have given up your Alberta Evangelical Christian Church licence to perform marriages, who recognizes you as an ordained minister?”
(D) Ordination and licensing are two different issues. One can be an ordained minister and under the accountability of a body of elders and not be licensed. The provincial license is specific to solemnizing marriages. Presently, I am simply Steve the Christian guy and claim to be nothing more.
Hi Bene D,
I am always Rose. That is my first name. In my haste to respond to the venom on various sites, I did not see a place to give a user name so rcmagpie came up by default. As for copy and pasting, there are only so many ways to say the same thing to the same kinds of comments.
Hi Rose:
Pleased to meet you. I understand you didn’t read what was posted in your eagerness to get your information out.
The cut and pastes on sites make it look like someone is paying you.
(That happens all the time – companies make a lot of money and politicians and lobbyists get their message out.
Most people online figure out cut and pastes are a con, so if you mean well, don’t be afraid use your own voice if you haven’t been hired by ECP, the CCF etc:^)
Stephen, do you really have any idea where I am heading with this? Obviously you have no clue of my background in x-tianity. I apologize for raising an issue of discussion which would only bore you, but as I had assumed, you have been unable to provide any conclusive answer. Everything you have said is based on your personal convictions, interpretations and assumptions mingled with traditional teachings from the church.
I am not ignorant enough to believe that I am introducing this to you for the first time, nor am I ignorant enough to think I could ever change your stubborn mind or heart, a work that according to your belief, could only be accomplished by the Holy Spirit and trust me, I’m not him.
Now, that being said, I’d like to point out that in all my years of x-tianity and devoted studies, never did I find Jesus speaking of any agenda outside of the religious institution ordained by god. He spoke of many agendas, but they were all related to corrupt leadership within the church. If you can find me one place where Jesus publicly spoke of an agenda of either an individual or group of people outside the church (in the world), then maybe your letter would have some merit.
Stephen, you are not of this world so I have to ask, what the hell are you doing mingling in its affairs and what scriptural basis gives you this right? Either you’re all Christian or you’re not. I’ve walked that path and given up more than you or anyone will ever know. I am not speaking as someone who has never opened a bible, I used to eat the ink for breakfast, lunch and supper!
Your response is typical of most Christians who have gotten to a position of comfort in their beliefs and are afraid to go any further because they know they will find out more than they wish to know or admit.
There is one profound thing you said that I wholeheartedly agree with, “As far as Christ’s word in red go, they are no more or less inspired than the ones in black.” That’s exactly what I found out after decades of pursuing true Christianity and precisely the reason I walked away from it.
You see Stephen, it’s not so much your ignorant opinion of homosexuality I take issue with, it’s the fact that as a professing Christian, you are sowing hatred, division and strife by propagating the stereotypical Christian homophobic view of homosexuals while at the same time trying to convince or persuade others that all homosexuals have a common dark and devious agenda.
Personally, I perceive two agendas, yours and theirs. Yours is to rid the word of homosexuals at any cost, and theirs is to be accepted and treated equally, with respect and dignity. Now which agenda is more Christ-like?
You of all people should know that according to the bible, there is no sin greater than another, aside from blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. If any have a desire to try and rid themselves of their homosexuality by giving Jesus a try, then great, all the power to them, but for those who don’t have such a desire, I suggest you stop trying to play the role of the Holy Spirit, adhere to the words of Jesus and “Let the dead bury the dead”.
I also recommend that if you feel you must make a stand for moral issues in the world, make sure your house is clean first. If you claim to be from the house of god, then a good place to start is with the Ted Haggards of the church. Once you’ve got that area cleaned up, then you can address the other adulterers, divorcees, thieves and blasphemers.
The burden of proof does not lie with the non-believers to prove god doesn’t exist, it lies on people like yourself, professing Christians, to prove he does. Based on what the world sees, there’s little evidence and you’re not helping the case!
If there’s one thing I have learned over my lifetime, it’s that someday I may have to eat my words and when the time comes, I had better make sure they are palatable.
Tim: I appreciate you posting the links regarding Hitler and how his religious beliefs played into his twisted thinking which resulted in the atrocities we are all familiar with. That should be a very grave lesson and warning to us all. It really opened my eyes and explained a few things I was wondering about. I’m more convinced than ever that mixing politics and religion makes for a poisonous chalice. I don’t agree with Stephen Boissoin when he mentioned stubbornness, I believe the Lord showed me this morning that it’s because of fear many find it so hard to face the possibility of giving up what had been a necessary thing for psychological survival. I believe one reason the sexual attraction is so strong, is because it is connected to a very real pychological need and perceived existential threat, and the prospect of being anything different can raise a specter of such overwhelming fear that is impossible to cope with alone, and I pray the Lord to minister His love, comfort and courage to such ones.
The scriptures are a mystery, and it truly does take the Holy Spirit to reveal the word of God to us, which we can only really receive in fullness as more and more of our fallen flesh nature is out of the way (crucified). At least this is the understanding I have come to so far and born out by some experience. The Christian walk is progressive, a journey on the narrow path (cross) towards Jesus Christ, and as we go along we ditch more and more of our burdens (sin) and gain more and more of Him in exchange (fruit). The Lord helps us by disciplining us, chastising our fallen flesh nature, and it is a painful Way (though not without it’s joys and reward!), but it has the effect of loosening our hold onto whatever it is we are holding onto that falls short of His will and image – and in this we will come to know we are “accepted as sons”.
He has very individual ways of helping different people in their own individual circumstances, but it is possible by the Spirit to even revisit and become conscious of the moment in our lives when we were forced by circumstances as it were to make a ’subconscious’ decision to take a wrong direction, unknowingly right into the enemy’s snare where we became entrapped. I can testify of two such occasions when the Lord helped me this way in my own particular life dilemmas when I began to agree with Him against my own sin, not with self-condemnation but just in truth.
When we receive the word of God which is truth, by the Spirit, not the letter, it truly has power to transform our minds from the inside, because “as a man thinketh, so is he.” As our thinking on a deep level becomes transformed the things connected to it will begin to fall into place. This is how the truth sets us free, as I understand it.
There’s no question in my mind that homosexuality is not the will of God for any person, and I believe it can have different causes for different people. It’s not as though anyone wakes up one morning and consciously decides who to become sexually attracted to, of course it’s more complicated and deeper than that, and those struggling with same-gender attractions can take comfort in the fact that “where sin abounds, grace more abounds”.
I believe the words that Jesus spoke in Mathew 19:4-6 can give us insight into our Lord’s mind on this matter if we take the time in His presence to really meditate on it: “‘Haven’t you read’, he replied, ‘that at the beginning the Creator made them male and female’, and said, ‘For this reason a man will leave his father and mother and be united to his wife, and the two will become one flesh’? So they are no longer two but one. Therefore what God has joined together, let man not separate.”
I don’t believe the church was commissioned by Jesus to do anything but preach the gospel, proclaiming the kingdom of heaven. We are not called to ‘influence’ or to change our society, we are not called to take over the government, we are not called to be law-givers but to proclaim the good news that our sins are forgiven for any who wish in freedom to be partakers of His grace. “The power of sin is the law”, so believers, (myself very much included!), need to learn how to preach the gospel without giving power to sin. If we are His spiritual people, citizens of heaven, we will follow Jesus’ example and eschew earthly politics as a body and stop condemning the lost.
As Paul said, “What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church…?” THIS is how we are to speak to the lost: “Be wise in the way you act towards outsiders; make the most of every opportunity. Let your conversation be always FULL of grace, SEASONED with salt, so that you may know how to answer everyone.” ‘Full’ speaks for itself, and by contrast ’seasoned’ means just a sprinkling, not throwing in the whole box. Because it’s not with wise and persuasive words that we win souls, and certainly not through condemnation – it’s by the power of the Spirit.
Hi Bene D,
Nice to meet you too. Thank you for the advice. I had not thought of that. And no, nobody hired me. I have been interested in HRC abuses for some time, but became interested in Steve’s case only the last few months after I began reading some of the outrageous details of it.
Regardless of where on stands on political, social, or spiritual, issues; most of us who comment on these blogs (I have only ever written on my local newspaper’s blog until this weekend) have probably at one time or another written things that offended people just as much as Steve’s Letter did. I am only asking people to sit back and examine their hearts and heads and ask how they would like to be labeled nationally as a hate-monger and dragged through the mud for over 7 years. He has kids, family, work and has to live in the community. Can people just have some empathy. And at the very least, if people get the facts on this case, realize the abuse of the law by these HRCs.
Rose, Stephen made his own bed and now he has to “lie” in it (pardon the pun). As a self-purported wise Christian, I’m sure he counted the cost before ever opening his mouth. I have no sympathy for him.
As far as empathy goes, you are right, we need to have some empathy, but in my case, it’s not for Stephen, but rather for his poor family who has to put up with him. I can only imagine the needless suffering he brought upon them, all because of his flagrant self-righteousness.
Therese,
I would agree with you on many points. I am suspect and cautious of anything the smells of Dominion Theology in any of it’s many forms. But I do believe, in keeping with the example of Jesus, the Prophets, John the Baptist and the Apostles, that we are called to speak out publicly about public evil, never for personal gain, but for the sake of the Gospel and righteousness, even if we get our heads cut off for doing so. This includes teaching in the public schools and grotesque behavior in the street that would get any heterosexual arrested. It certainly should include voting, petitioning leaders, heck, even blogging!. And yes, it should be with humility and grace.
Regarding Hitler and Christianity:
It would be helpful to do some research on the occult origins of the Nazi Party. Yes, Hitler made references to Christianity; he was living in Europe which had a strong Christian history, and had to appeal to the citizens. “Christian” can be an ethnic term, just like Jew or Muslim can. It doesn’t tell you what a person actually believes. America is sometimes called a Christian country, but the actual percent of true believing Christians, I believe is quite small. Likely even smaller in Canada. I think more people dabble in Eastern religion than read their Bible. And many Churches were and are more ceremonial than spiritual.
Hitler actually wanted to rewrite the Bible, getting rid of any concept of Judeo-Christianity. What is repulsive and embarrassing to think that some of their Churches supported Hitler, but remember with gratitude those who did not and suffered the consequences. Just as sin always has consequences, speaking up publicly against evil, often does too.
Rose, I think mixing Christian beliefs with the occult is essentially what is going on with the ‘religious right’ and dominionists. How many of the “Christian” politicians in Washington are also Freemasons? I even think some big-name ministers may be Freemasons, according to some sources. Look also at Rick Joyner and the Knights of Malta (and his protegee Todd B.) Catholicism also is mixed with occult practices, which was the religion Hitler was raised on, and it hasn’t escaped me that we seem to be seeing an increasing move back towards Catholicism by much of the evangelical church.
I would argue that the OT prophets were rebuking God’s own people, not unbelieving gentiles – the same with John the Baptist and Jesus. When Jesus spoke to “outsiders” (non-Jews), eg, the Samaritan woman at the well, He spoke the truth very graciously, He didn’t rebuke her angrily. I stand to be corrected, but at present I don’t recall any instances of the apostles rebuking anyone but those who purported to be Christians.
This has all been difficult for me to grasp and articulate, but what I understand is that as individual believers, we do what we do where we live according to our best understanding – eg, we vote according to our conscience, we may write letters to newspaper editors, we hopefully speak our opinion to an unbelieving society in a way that is full of grace and only seasoned with salt, etc, and whatever our field of endeavour as individuals happens to be, whether politics or education, or media or whatever, we do our best work according to our best understanding at the time, but I hope humbly, knowing that ours is an unfolding revelation and that at best we only see as in a mirror darkly (preaching to myself) – but I don’t believe that we are do these kinds of things in the name of Jesus as the body of Christ. The only thing we are to do in His name is preach the gospel and heal the sick – that is all I can see that we are commissioned to do as the church, and I think that should be our focus, rather than trying to rescue a perishing world with fleshly methods, whether politics or letter-writing campaigns. Maybe I’m missing something, but that’s where I stand at present.
(And actually, I consider whether we will find ourselves talking less and less about “social issues” as we grow in the Lord, becoming like Paul who “resolved to know nothing but Christ and Him crucified”. And like Job, who after those all lengthy discourses with his ‘friends’, when He saw the Lord, even though he was considered righteous and was not in the wrong, it silenced him.)
I’m very sorry for what Stephen Boissoin has gone through, and even though I am dismayed at the tone of his letter, in my opinion I don’t believe his letter constitutes malicious hate literature. How the human rights tribunal decides such things is beyond me though, I don’t know what criteria they have drawn up – I rather think the line should be drawn at incitement to violence or something tangible like that. People can say all kinds of insulting things to one another in the heat of the moment in a free society and not expect to be hauled up before the law. Isn’t it possible though, that if people are genuinely feeling hated and rejected, there’s a good chance this is what is being projected, (giving the benefit of the doubt to the complainant that he wasn’t just using the system to be vindictive) and I don’t think that is what Christians should be manifesting.
What I believe I see on both sides of this debate is fear – fear on the one hand of a society deteriorating into pagan Godlessness, and fear on the other of becoming stigmatized, rejected and made into outcasts (or outlaws). I believe all these feelings are valid and understandable, however, speaking to believers, I don’t think we should be doing things for Jesus out of fear. If we speak rejecting and condemning words to those who are trapped in sin, which is wrong in itself, but how will they be able to come to Christ when we set up such a roadblock? Jesus didn’t come to condemn sinners, He came to offer grace and that is what we should always manifest. I think most Christians share the understanding that these are the last days, we know in a general sense what to expect, the harlot church riding the beast political/economic system, darkness is increasing – but why should we fear? Our mandate and reason for being on this earth does not change no matter what kind of culture we happen to be “passing through”. The early church spent its infancy in much worse circumstances than we presently have up to now – and how glorious it was in those early days, and how much more glorious it will be in the near future. When these things begin to happen, I believe we need to ’ look UP for our redemption draws nigh’, not ‘look around at the terrible state of things’.
I think that the Left often uses the term “Christian Right” as a pejorative for every Bible believing Christian who ever opens their mouth about anything. I think the best thing that Christians should do is become fully educated, first about Scripture and also about the affiliations of leaders in the church. Certainly if someone was a Freemason, I would not seek counsel from them. And I feel very uncomfortable when I see any spiritual leader smiling for the camera with politicians or any flavor.
Therese, I agree with your attitude. A little persecution, or a lot, never seemed to hurt the church. When the persecution starts you find out who will truly defend the Gospel and those who don’t, and those remaining are more affective than ever. I think whatever God sends our way we should consider it a blessing as hard as it may seem at the time.
Jesus always showed grace to the humble and the Law to those who exhibited pride and that is what the Apostles did too. The Apostle’ letters speak directly to the churches, but in the book of Acts, they speak to non believers too and the principle seems to be the same: grace to the humble, the Law to the proud. When I say the Law, I don’t mean loosing your temper but I do mean speaking the truth plainly. It will not make you popular with those who continue to be proud.
I believe when we see government abuses, we should speak out in a democratic society when we have the opportunity to. In that regard, it’s fine to criticize Stephen Boissoin’s speech, as if I had never ranted and raved about something. That’s was over 7 years ago. This is also about abuse by government officials that has happened to many in this country, usually targeted at people who cannot afford huge legal bills to set a precedent for convictions or settlements. It can happen to anyone that these HRCs don’t like. Or it they believe that an offence has been committed against a favored group. Thankfully Steve fought back and many began to speak out, including the judge in this case, so it hopefully won’t happen to anyone else soon, no matter what they want to speak or write about.
As you can imagine…I have been bombarded by the media. I participated in numerous interviews today, most this evening. I was hoping to respond to some the posts but after reading the great detail (length) that some of them include, I am far too tired tonight.
Bene. I will email you my old, outdated, no longer valid clergy license when I get to my office tomorrow. Hopefully that will put an end to who I was, am, is or should be. Hang it on your wall if you like. You are the only one that has ever wanted to see it.
Ps…In every interview I make it clear that I have resigned. Google my name. Do you think I have time to correct every article, column, blog etc where they still refer to my as Pastor or Reverend? If you review the recent media, they are starting to get it right.
pss. Tim, the best apologia that I can muster up tonight is “you are completely out to lunch.” (Hope you chuckled) I don’t think that there is a thing I could say to convince you. I will try to break down your post tomorrow. Though I ask myself, why do you want to hear from me further? Are you convincing yourself of the validity of your claims through my posts or do you sincerely want to know what I think? Please answer in brief if you can.
Talk soon and sincere blessings,
Stephen Boissoin
“I think that the Left often uses the term “Christian Right” as a pejorative for every Bible believing Christian who ever opens their mouth about anything.”
I’m a bible believing Christian, you didn’t see me calling Stephen Boissoin a hate pimp.
I suggest reading Justice Wilson’s ruling.
Section F #140
“…He admitted that with his letter he was hoping to ride on the coattails of the C.C.C. that is – that he would be associated with some of their political work.”
Jesus isn’t in the Red Deer letter, nor is the gospel.
Political co-belligerents in the US are saying, ‘oh, Boissoin didn’t get jailed, but it could happen here. Send money.’
I think your point about fear is well taken Therese.
Rose, I have no sympathy for Steven Boissoin.
Egale declined to join Dr. Lund in his complaint in 2005:
…“We want Pastor Boissoin’s assertions aired, debated and subjected to public scrutiny…”
We believe that sunshine is the best disinfectant.”
Here are some notable examples that they’re getting it right…yaayyyyyy!!!! Please note the word ‘former.’
The Canadian Press
Date: Friday Dec. 4, 2009 7:12 AM ET
EDMONTON — A Court of Queen’s Bench judge has ruled an anti-gay letter written by a former Alberta pastor in 2002 was not a hate crime and is allowed under freedom of speech.
National Post Dec 4, 2009
The 2002 letter by Mr. Boissoin, then a pastor in Red Deer, was titled “Homosexual Agenda Wicked,” and published in the Red Deer Advocate.
National Post editorial board: From Alberta, a win for justice
Posted: December 07, 2009, 8:30 AM by NP Editor
Editorial, Canadian politics
Former Red Deer, Alberta youth pastor Stephen Boissoin…
Lorne Gunter
Edmonton Journal
Sunday, December 06, 2009
If you want to see all the things wrong with human rights commissions, they are on display in Mr. Justice Earl Wilson’s ruling Thursday in the case of Boissoin v Lund.
Stephen Boissoin is a former youth pastor from Red Deer who wrote a letter to the Red Deer Advocate in June 2002 expressing harsh, unpleasant, even contemptible views about the gay rights movement.
Even the gays get it wrong at times. Hmmmmm I wonder what their agenda is in doing so.
In 2002, the Red Deer Advocate published a letter by Rev Stephen Boissoin, titled “Homosexual Agenda Wicked.” It’s a nonsensical rant against gay rights…Dec 4, 2009 xtra.ca
From Stephen Boissoin’s letter:
“My banner has now been raised and war has been declared so as to defend the precious sanctity of our innocent children and youth, that you so eagerly toil, day and night, to consume. With me stand the greatest weapons that you have encountered to date – God and the “Moral Majority.” Know this, we will defeat you, then heal the damage that you have caused.”
“These activists are not morally upright citizens, concerned about the best interests of our society. They are perverse, self-centered and morally deprived individuals who are spreading their psychological disease into every area of our lives. Homosexual rights activists and those that defend them, are just as immoral as the pedophiles, drug dealers and pimps that plague our communities.”
Not even the Son of God spoke so belligerently to the Pharisees. The letter is simply bellicose and insulting . I just cannot imagine Jesus or the Apostles railing like this even against the hedonistic Greco-Roman culture of their day – I still cannot find any example of it in the scriptures, though I am still searching.
Stephen, I don’t doubt you feel you are doing God’s will, and I still believe people ought to be able to speak their honest mind without fear of legal repercussions, unless they are calling for illegal activity, BUT please consider that you are declaring war against living, breathing, feeling human beings when scripture tells us that we war not against flesh and blood, and that our weapons are not carnal, but spiritual. We are exhorted to keep our minds on things above (spiritual) not on the things of earth. Is the realm of politics and law earthly or spiritual?
Please stop and think, do you honestly imagine after such a diatribe you could now preach the good news of salvation and forgiveness to homosexuals and expect any one of them to be able to open their hearts to Jesus? Do you think any homosexual person would allow you to minister healing or to even pray for them after you declared yourself and God to be his or her enemy and accused him or her of being a “morally depraved human being who is spreading their psychological disease into every area of our lives “?? Is that truly how you think we should talk to people we are hoping to lead to the Lord? Is that how you want them to view Jesus who came not to condemn but to save? Has the Spirit of the Lord ever talked to you in such viscious terms, even though the same things could arguably be said for every one of us since sin resides in all our flesh alike? Your statement has a ring of crazed fanaticism and would not be out of place amongst Adolph Hitler’s writings unfortunately.
I’m not surprised at the following from Bene’s comment above, since you identify yourself with the “Moral Majority”:
“…He admitted that with his letter he was hoping to ride on the coattails of the C.C.C. that is – that he would be associated with some of their political work.” ”
Please remember that Jesus and the early church did not get involved in “political solutions” because there is only one solution to what ails mankind, only one way to overcome sin, and that is through the foolishness of the gospel. Jesus died for homosexuals every bit as much as he died for the self-righteous and self-congratulatory “moral majority”. I do not believe your letter reflects the spirit we want to be walking in as ministers of reconciliation. Please, brother, if you are still going in this direction, I beseech you to reconsider what you are doing, which is not the way of the Spirit but the way of religion and oppression.
“Either way, my personal opinion is that homosexuality is unnatural, unproductive, immoral, destructive and outright disgusting.”- Stephen Boissoin – June 2008
Stephen emailed me about his ordination and ministerial credentials.
I understand him saying he was licenced by the province of Alberta from 2001 to 2006.
As he has pointed out he is now Stephen Boissoin, not Reverend Stephen Boissoin.
Tenses matter.
Therese,
War was declared and I did just fight and win a seven year campaign. Did you miss my seven year battle?
I remember my friend Richard cautioning me, “if you write something against the homosexual lobby, you will end up in a war.” He was right. I was even threatened and told that I should watch my back because one day when I least expect it, I would be stabbed with an HIV infected syringe.
In the end, all that will be left is the moral majority. Those who were repentent in their heart and did their best to make Jesus Lord of their life.
Here is an idea if you are interested in two-way dialogue. Instead of writing me a lengthy lecture which I will not read or respond to, why not write a few short paragraphs at a time, tell me something and ask me a question or two. Then, let me respond and communicate ‘with you’. Otherwise, you’re talking to yourself cause I ain’t listening.
Lengthy rants on blogs denote a sense of entitlement and self-importance. You are judging me based on your interpretation of my letter. Possibly not your intent but really, do you think I am going to read a rant directed towards me on a blog from someone I don’t even know? Why not pick my brain while you have me here.
Peace,
ps…some of the most stinging rebukes in the NT were to the Pharisees. One place to start would be Matthew 23. I think the words are in red too.
There is nothing in my letter that is unbiblical or against flesh and blood. The letter is against the biased propagation of homosexuality to children and youth.
Steve B
Dear faithful Christians:
Don’t believe a word that this man says because I contacted the denominationa\he was ordained with and it appears that this man was on probation for not following through the very things he promised and signed to do as a part of his covenant with God.
He will give all kind of excuses, but the denomination believes in doing things the right way and this is not one of them. They feel that they would have helped him do the right thing if he would have asked for their wisdom in this matter.
Stephen, not even Jesus would allow anyone to call Him “good”, much less apply it to Himself. He said, “Why do you call me good? There is no one good but the Father.” He knew what was in His flesh. The only reason the “Moral Majority” congratulate themselves on being “moral” is because they don’t know themselves very well – you don’t know how prideful and self-righteous that moniker looks even to the perishing, how much more so to our heavenly Father who knows us much better than we know ourselves.
I see a fleshly response to fleshly fear in what you are doing, brother. You are so euphoric (fleshly emotions which seem to border on cultishness) you can’t even concentrate on a lengthy post – even though this issue is of such importance to you that you gave up 7 years of your life for it. But is this what Jesus called us for? To legislate people into ‘behaving’, which can’t save them, or to preach the good news which can? We can’t do both as I tried to demonstrate with my previous comment, and we can’t be both citizens of earth and heaven at the same time.
I hope when you have caught your breath and are in a calmer state of mind, you’ll be able to consider some of the points that have been put forward. But, honestly, based on your comments here (aside from the original letter), I don’t think I want to pick your brain – I’ve seen too much of it already and it scares me.
I fear I’m late to this party but I can’t but to respond to Timothy’s ridiculous comments at the beginning of the thread.
As someone actually trained in biblical interpretation I’d like to point out some serious problems.
1) The bible never mentions human rights, the concept is a modern one. The bible does say we are all created in His image which confers upon us value regardless of who we are and what we do.
2) There was a time when the people of Israel believed they were better than the surrounding gentiles. Both Jesus and Peter blew that concept out of the water. Paul made it clear that being in Christ erases all the distinctions created by our society.
3) Paul made it clear he believed that homosexual sex was a sin. He lists it along with drunkenness, greed, and being verbally abusive. If being gay means you have no human rights than spouting off abusive lies disguised as biblical truth would do the same thing.
4) According to the full counsel of scripture biblical marriage also includes having dozens of wives and concubines.
5) There is something even more cunning than the completely exaggerated “homosexual agenda.” The leaven of the pharisees.
Loyal Christian,
I have endeavoured to be honest here, so I will continue as I feel led. Scripture tells us to use honest scales, so I will offer my side of the story to bring balance. Also, I have already touched on the fact that I resigned to a doctrinal dispute..which is true.
If you did contact them, then what they told you was a partial truth. It shocks me that they would even openly dialogue about it but it once again confirms why I resigned. I left them, they did not ask me to leave at any time and were offended when I did. That offence obviously remains which is unfortunate because I have never spoken negatively about them. The ministry that I undertook has never been in question and is well known and spoken of.
Specifically, I was put on a probationary status after my refusal to give them my whole tithe. Had I just complied everything would have been rectified. Instead I disagreed with their request.
I had a problem with tithing to them on top of what I gave to the church I attended while in parachurch ministry. I informed them that I was tithing to my home church and into my community. They wanted my tithe, I would not give it to them. That was strike one for me. Strike two was their views on end times doctrine. They hold to a futurist view, I am a preterist (past fulfilled). I do not believe that the end of the age referred to in scripture refers to our future. I could have just sent them my tithe consistently and hid my beliefs and everything would have been fine. Instead, after much consideration, I chose to be honest and resigned. If you wish to judge me by this, feel free, my reputation in this sense matters not anymore.
Doctrinally, I do not believe that the tithe carried over into the New Covenant. The tithe was administered to support the Priesthood in a theocracy and there is no biblical account of money being given as a tithe.
When the Jerusalem Council met (Acts 15) tithing was not an admonition for the Gentiles that were turning to Christianity.
My belief is now that we in saved by grace, we are Christ’s. Our entire life, money, time, etc is to be given over to God’s leading. We are his servants. If one can give more and another less, that is between them and God.
Hope this helps,
Oh ya, did you say something Therese? lol…just playing…obviously you have your opinion of me and have made it clear that there is nothing I can say to convince you otherwise. So be it.
Stephen Boissoin
Therese,
I will respond to some of your comments here in brief.
Stephen, not even Jesus would allow anyone to call Him “good”, much less apply it to Himself.
“I do believe that there is good in me but I also agree with what Paul said in Romans 7 about the struggle each of us face with our desire to do good and the temptation that goes along with it. I too depend on Christ and agree with him when he states “Who will rescue me from this body of death? Thanks be to God—through Jesus Christ our Lord!”
The only reason the “Moral Majority” congratulate themselves on being “moral” is because they don’t know themselves very well…
“I am not interested in how things look. I am interterested in being active as a Christian and you seem to want to judge me based on your opinion of one letter. I congratulate God for helping me identify what is moral in his eyes and I also congratule Him for giving me the courage to state it publicly.”
To legislate people into ‘behaving’, which can’t save them, or to preach the good news which can?
“It was Lund who was trying to legislate my behaviour, not the opposite. I don’t understand your context here.”
I hope when you have caught your breath and are in a calmer state of mind, you’ll be able to consider some of the points that have been put forward. But, honestly, based on your comments here (aside from the original letter), I don’t think I want to pick your brain – I’ve seen too much of it already and it scares me.
“Now there’s a paragraph that is really as odds with itself”
Blessings sister Therese
Woops…I only intended to bold my responses. Sorry.
Stephen is under the delusion that every thing is man’s fault. He makes statements that we can’t prove. I’m interested in the man that said on these bolgs that the denomination he once was ordained with has proof as to why he left.Diffeent from Stephen’s sence he disagrees with all doctrines that are conservative. Poor Stephen, he is right and you are wrong. Is he hiding the truth from all of us – I say let God be true and man a liar. It will be revealed to us someday. Let it happen.
Stephen, when I used the word “looks” I was being kind. Anyhow, I’ll be kind again and not point out your inconsistencies. ;o)
I’m just trying to imagine how the conversation went at the dinner table when Jesus was eating with the tax collectors and prostitutes. Somehow I can’t seem to get that sense of Him telling His dinner guests, or hosts, that they were morally depraved human beings who were spreading their psychological disease into every area of our lives, and that their lives were outright disgusting, but hey, I’ll keep trying. (oy.)
Okay, this part is sincere: I truly hope you’ll stop and think about Jesus’ statement that “my kingdom is not of this world” one day soon….and blessings to you too.
I too have sat with many of the same, bought them the best steaks and allowed the to live in my home.
Again, read how Jesus treated the Pharisees in Matthew. Does God care less about a Pharisee than a tax collector or prostitute? No he does not. He is no respecter of persons.
Jesus had a very diverse personality. He even turned over the money lenders tables with whip in hand and on another occasion warned “if anyone causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him to have a large millstone hung around his neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea.
The words of the prophets, Jesus and the Apostles are consistent with the character of God and cannot be dismissed. You must have a real problem with the God of the OT.
Again, a gay minster was teaching a pro-homosexual interpretation of the Bible in my sons school. In addition, the Alberta Human Rights Commission was funding an initiative to teach that homosexuality was normal, necessary, acceptable and productive and has been for thousands of years. I strongly disagree!!!
My contempt was warranted. I understand that you feel diffferently.
Bless you!!
Hey Everyone
I am willing to believe this denomination then listen on and on about why he left. Did he say it was over doctrine -he is dreaming!!!
Good Day,
My name is Dr. David Lavigne, I am the Bishop of the Evangelical Christian Church in Canada. I have receiving unwanted emails from Mr. Boissoin which is causing our leadership great concern, and I wish to go on record regarding Mr. Boissoin.
I have read a great deal of what this gentleman has been saying and writing and I want to say on behalf of our organization, EVERYTHING that he has written and said is NOT the opinions and beliefs of the Evangelical Christian Church in Canada.
I hope this will clear up any doubts.
Thank you.
Rev. Dr. D. Lavigne
Bishop
John, you said,
“Any victory for freedom of speech is great and the gays are hateful people”
Freedom of speech works both ways. You want to see ugly? What do you suppose would happen if someone took the word “gay” in Stephen’s letter and replaced it with the word “Christian”?
I shutter to think of all the hate and death threats that would ensue from loving followers of Christ. Touch not the sacred cow of religion. Look at the fuss the atheist buses and billboards have caused. Look at the contempt for critics and skeptics who exercise free speech doubting the existence of any god. Look at the vitriol displayed by Christians in the “war on Christmas”. Yet somehow it’s okay for Christian leaders to paint all gay people with the same brush as the most vile despicable group that threatens to erode its very foundations and corrupt its children. It’s okay to keep shoving them back under the rocks they crawled out from. How hateful/fearful is that? How does it demonstrate Christ, which is what Christians were put here to do?
The Christian machine is constantly warring with everything that threatens (real or imagined) its evolving identity and very existence. But why? Natural instinct? Fear? Control freaks?… just as Peter was willing to fight to prevent them from taking his Jesus away in the garden, the master said to put down the sword. Sadly, the visible church has never learned.
Yes, hurray for the right to free speech. Just hope we ALL can take it as well as we can dish it out.
When something we don’t like is said to us, when a judgement we feel is wrong is made known unto us, when the word from out of our mouths is connected to the brain and not the heart, and when someone says I HATE YOU then what are we supposed to do, make enemies out of them or try to understand what makes them tick and why their actions offend us so. When we have a battle and take it to the law then the law may win for us the victory but at the end of the day we have probably, in the process of that victory, made an enemy and if we are totally honest with ourselves that victory is not satisfaction but a reaction and the ‘faction’ is all that won. Love pursues beyond all endurance to keep ‘the doors’ open in order to bring all elements, circumstances, peoples, and ‘their ways’ to a place that all may have a voice and be listen’d to and in the process receive respect, sadly though the human has little patience for such endurance ‘as the present wars show us’. Endurance = longs to keep going until all are happy that they have been heard, have been understood and have reached a place of mutual respect even if dislike surrounds that respect. Think how patient Jesus has been and for how long as we stumble and falter so often on our journey towards his heart.
Jesus doesn’t take sides, he stands in the middle and takes the blows then quietly weeps as our determination to win, means that he can’t.
LOVE NEVER FAILS either one or the other, he always gifts both with his loss not ours) Thank you Jesus may your way win as we lose ours.
Amen, hopeome, that nicely sums up what I’m taking away from this discussion, finally after all my pontificating, blah, blah, blah. ;o) I’ve been thinking “let God be true and every man a liar” all day (in other words, we are all wrong and only He is right). Lo and behold I just noticed someone used that as their moniker above, as well as your comment. Think maybe Someone is trying to tell me something?
It’s not easy coming to that place where we can truly trust God enough to leave all judgments and outcomes in His hands, but when we do it’s very freeing, it was never a load we were meant to carry, and we are freer to just love without conditions and restraints.
I have been trying to sort out some of the information that I have been reading from Stephen B., and I would like honest answers from him.
You say you left your former denomination because you disagreed over their doctrine, and yet you practice these doctrines still. What doctrine did you disagreed with?
Second, you want people to think that your position over gays is commendable, and yet the denomination you were once with held you accountable in word and deed and yet you were not in good standing with them. Do you have proof that you were in good standing?
Does integrity mean anything today to those who want to see the church cleaned up over people like him, who go from church to church, and yet no body checks out references from either the denomination they were once with, or the church they once served.
I am wondering if it is time the church, as a whole, wakes up and see that the church of Jesus Christ is being hurt because of what… Money, more members! Is this what it is all about today? I know the things are not great today but where is the integrity in our churches or our denominations?
It seems that certain organizations are running like mills and yet people like Stephen comes along, offers some money, tells them that they are the good guy, and it is believed with any proof, and bang they are ministers!!
I am just looking for honest answers from those who are not afraid to state the truth about themselves……
Its not easy you are right, and the battles along the way, generally with ourselves, are the testing grounds for him to show us who we are and who in the answers he is. When we come under fire it hurts, we just have to know where in action to put that hurt and how. Mine usually ends up ‘digging the garden’ or furiously hoovering ! either way is should be constructive not destrutive.
Stephen Boissoin
I took another look at your letter. There are number of things I find particularly disturbing.
1) You aren’t sticking up for biblical truth. If you had stuck to saying what Paul says in the New Testament no one would have filed any complaints against you. This letter goes well beyond that.
You describe an insidious movement full of people as morally depraved as pedophiles with a sub-element that wants to normalize sex with children. You paint the entire movement with the same brush. Such rhetoric does polarize people and it does plant the seeds of hatred.
Any movement will have its fringe elements, in evangelicalism we have Christians that want to take over the world and impose theocratic rule until Jesus returns. I wouldn’t want to be painted with that brush.
It is my impression that the gay rights movement in Canada is full of people who have known nothing but same-sex attraction in their life and they don’t want to be fired, bullied, or mistreated because of it. They want this because they are discriminated against, they are bullied, abused, beat up and rejected. What most of them want is fair and right.
What was the sin of sodom and gommorah?
Eze 16:49 ” ‘See here — this was the iniquity of your sister Sodom: She and her daughters had majesty, abundance of food, and enjoyed carefree ease, but they did not help the poor and needy.
Eze 16:50 They were haughty and practiced abominable deeds before me. Therefore when I saw it I removed them.
The culture war is a war after the flesh. In it the weapons are carnal. As soon as we start wielding these carnal weapons, those weapons begin to wield us.
There are more important things to care about.
Alright, time to jump in.
I have written the EEC and David Lavigne to see if the comment above (49) is legitimate.
If this comment does come from David Lavigne, commenting on a blog is an extraordinary step for the head of a credentialing organization/denomination to take.
The Evangelical Christian Church is an recognized charity in Canada, and a member in good standing with The Evangelical Association of Canada.
I would not at all doubt that it is him Bene.
I did contact David via email to ask if he was speaking negatively about me due to the comments of one poster above. He would not give me an answer.
Clarification: At NO TIME over the last 7.5 years did I say that my letter, my comments, my personal opinion were the opinions of David Lavingne’s organization. We in fact, have never had a conversation about this topic or my letter and I was never contacted about the letter by him or ‘the leadership.’ The letter was my opinion and in no way represents the ECCC which used to be the CECC.
Like I stated about, the reason I resigned was due to a disagreement over the amount of money I was giving…which admittedlty was very little. Had they had an issue over my letter, they NEVER notified me of such until this blog which appears odd for a Christian organization, to me anyways.
Many Christian organizations did not support my letter but thousands across the US and Canada did.
As I have told David, I hope the best for him and his organization. I have nothing negative to say about him or his group.
Wow, this is exciting stuff for your blog eh Bene?
I am sooooo glad that I am removed the ‘institution’ of Christianity and free to be simply Steve. Love’n it!!
Mr Bossoin
When you use that word opinion it just about says it all. We have more opinions on this earth than we have people to express them. An opinion is an interpretation of the status quo. The gift is to know where that opinion came from and whether it was gifted in spite, grief, hope, or hell. We can usually tell from the consequences. Are the consequences you are receiving those with which you set out from or are you learning from the consequences as I hope we all are. The ideal of course is to not need conequences but to take them in order to make others less. To stir up is to make sure that you know not only the consequences but the long term effects of them and to know that our Father who watches over us knows sees and weeps at mans inability to see them.
‘In my opinion’ IS THE ROOT CAUSE OF WHAT WE HAVE IN THE WORLD TODAY I hope that when we next ‘have an opinion we will share it with 1. Those we can trust with it 2. An understanding that when we gift an opinion we make ourselves known as a result of it and 3. That opinions are, for the most part, a PAIN IN THE NECK unless we know how to receive them as well as give them out. Opinions cause wars on every level, that hat is rubbish, that dinner was crap, and so on, its what drives someone to give it and in what manner that counts and to recognise the many hidden agendas that come with them as well as swallowing the hurt we receive from then untill we get chance and a safe place to ‘dump it’
Americas church is full of opinions and empty of the unconditional love that it needs to overthrow them so I can understand why they received you in ‘all their glory’ and not the Fathers. However that said, in my opinion! I DO HOPE THAT THE BARBED PERSONAL COMMENTS ARE KEPT TO A MINIMUM SO THAT WE HAVE THE FREEDOM AND SPACE AND PLACE TO BE ABLE TO LEARN HOW TO EXPRESS THEM AND HOW TO RECEIVE THEM WITH A GLAD HEART THAT REQUIRES NURTURE NOT THE TORTURE THAT SO OFTEN COMES WITH OPINION. In my opnion the price of tomatoes seems to have rocketed recently and I am most annoyed especially as I love passata. CAN WE PLEASE HAVE A NICE DAY YOU’ALL. Thank you Bene for allowing us the time and the place for our ’say’
I think hopeome is saying that we should “Lean not on our opinion, er, understanding, but in all our ways acknowledge God.” : o )
Fear is of the flesh, God has not given it to us – when we react out of fear, it is a fleshly response, not spiritual. We can trust God, acknowledging His sovereignty on this earth no matter what the circumstances, and trust (acknowledge) that He is working and not asleep.
Hopeome,
I agree that we should not simply have an uneducated opinion……but…the fact is…even your post is representative of the ‘your opinion.’ Your opinion is rooted in things that have influenced you and that you believe to be true. Every post in this blog is somewhat subjective and the reader must decide, through research, reflection, prayer etc etc how they will receive it. Don’t miscontrue my use of the word opinion and turn it into something that I never intended it to be.
I would agree that there are for too many uneducated and/or self motivated opinions out there but when religion and morality, very controversial subjects, are at play, the freedom to voice hearfelt opinion matters.
My ‘opinion’ is rooted in what I believe to be the proper understanding of the Word of God. I believe that homosexual behaviour and the propagation of that behaviour (which was the focal point of my 2002 letter) is immoral and deplorable. Unfortunately, as time passes and certain behaviours become the norm, we tend to extend more grace towards these behaviours. Doing so weakens not only the voice of the church but as well the ability for the Christian to have a culture, even in the church, to support him/her. A weak Christian culture causes much confusion, stumbling and consequence. We have a weak Christian culture, that is fat and lazy, full of compromise and often presents a distorted message of grace. We (me included) need a strong Christian culture, especially among leaders, so we can feel a sense of true moral support and expectation that enhances our intent and ability to do that which is right.
Now, I am not saying that we are not to have significant grace for the repentant sinner because I certainly believe that we are to extend much. How could I not think such when God has extended His own amazing grace to me more times than I can recall? I was not a Christian (far from it) during my teenage and young adult years.
Now, I expect that this response will be picked apart, over analyzed and subject to rebut that is full of speculation BUT I have learned to expect that in the arena of opinion whether in the church or outside of it.
I love Jesus as my Lord and Saviour and am grateful for His love, grace, forgiveness and never ending mercy. I see Him at work in my life, building a better Steve in the process. We have a great Saviour!!!!
Simply Steve
Screw the opinions. I’ll state the facts. Stephen, you’re a bigot and you have yet to provide anything conclusive for me, nor have you broken down my post as you said you would.
It’s funny how you play the typical game… You make the statement that I cannot be convinced, insinuating that I am the stubborn hard-headed one here and therefore you can just disregard me. On the contrary, Stephen, I am the one who is asking to be convinced, beyond the shadow of a doubt. Maybe you can do it and maybe you can’t, but don’t label me as the one who is unteachable because if I had no interest, I wouldn’t be asking questions. Provide indisputable truth and you’ve won me over.
This could be a tough challenge for you though, considering many in the same camp as you (other professing Christians) also disagree with your approach. Maybe you can convince them while you convince me. The ball’s in your court.
Tim, please understand that there a are lot of comments that I am trying to respond to please constant phone calls from all four corners of the globe. I will try to respond further to your questions/accusations but I am unsure if you will ever be satisfied with any answer I give.
The poster using the name ‘Let God Be True And Every Man A Liar’ – Following is a response in point form to some of your questions.
- As I have stated previously, the CECC had nothing to do with my letter. Absolutely, NOTHING. At no time did they provide me with their opinion on it and at NO TIME did we even discuss it. They have only been brought into the conversation because Bene asked me specific questions which I did my best to answer. They should be dropped from the convo and allowed to carry on. After this post, I will only comment about them again if forced to.
- All the proof I can offer is that they accepted me and all my references which consisted of real men and real organizations…many whom I am still friends with today. I would caution you not to try to villainize me or the situation. Simply, take it for what it is. They are a smaller but credible Christian organization and I do not represent them or their opinion. I was legally licensed through them for a brief period of time. I was obviously in good standing at one point and was licensed to solemnize marriages which I did perform, including my own brothers wedding. Eventually, I resigned due to doctrinal differences. That is the story and there is nothing more to it friend. If you are looking for a scapegoat consider, there are men with bullet proof credentials who fall into controversial circumstances without everyone agreeing with them. IF you are trying to discredit me you are only appeasing yourself and those who may be equally as naive (IF this is the case).
- If you feel it necessary to gain an accurate opinion of me or my previous capacity as a, primarily para-church minister, contact the President of the Red Deer Ministerial Association who has known me personally in a capacity as my mentor and as a minister for approximately ten years. You are also free to contact my Christian attorney Gerry Chipeur who has known me since 2002. OR…simply ask and I will answer honestly. Literally, ask anything you wish. I am not here because I feel that I must answer all questions. I am simply here to partake in the convo and be as honest as possible considering that my 2002 letter has caused a great deal of fuss.
- In 15 years of both part and fulltime ministry I have worked in three churches in two different cities. I still have young adults and parents who contact me to thank me for my involvement in the formative part of thier life. This is true for any youth minsiter.
- I speak as an individual here. I am no longer a minister and am not affiliated with any organization. I agree with the CECC’s (now ECCC) core doctrines, Christ and Him crucified. I believe in Jesus as God incarnate, crucified, died, buried, resurrected and ascended into heaven etc etc. He reigns as King forever and salvation is found only in Him!!! I disagree with some of what I believe are their/our non-salvific doctrines, yet still important ones.
- Understand, there are many ministers who do not necessarily agree with all of the doctrines that their denomination espouses yet they still sign annual statements of faith and keep their questioning on the down low because they have a family and need their job. I did not want to be one of these people. I needed to be honest with myself and my own journey. I also believe that NO man should be prevented from having the freedom to THINK freely. NO man should be subject to unconstructive criticism for thinking freely and taking time to state his beliefs with confidence. This is often NOT the case. Theological institutions are pumping out clones that can only espouse a specific position. I did not want to be one of these bookend Christians. I also DO NOT believe that any man should have the title ‘Reverend.’
- Doctrinal Differences that caused me to resign as a minister: I post these to answer your questions. If you wish to debate or discuss them further, please email me at sboissoin@gmail.com.
1. My understanding at this time is that references to Hell in the NT when understood in the original language and context are NOT referring to a place of eternal torment.
2. There is no mandatory tithe in the NT but instead the magnification of free will offerings.
3. There is no future and literal end of the world via God’s judgement.
4. There is no future second coming of Christ.
5. In hold to a Preterist (past fulfilled) interpretation of scripture. Both the end of the ‘AGE’ and second coming (Parousia) are correlating events that were expected to occur in context to the NT church in the first century.
As time passed, I realised that I could not longer sign the CECC statement of faith or other related documents. I needed to be honest with myself. I choose to resign and simply be Steve under God. Since, I have still been invited to consult for youth organization, to preach from the pulpit, at youth and other Christian events.
Where I think your train of thinking could be applied is here. There are many denominations (thousands actually) that start-up thinking that they have the whole counsel of God when really they have not even studied opposing views. As an individual this was a foundational reason as to why I stepped out of fulltime ministry. I wanted to journey and be introduced to the many opposing view within Christendom hoping to learn more truth as I did so. Thus far, this has been my experience.
Blessing to all,
Stephen Boissoin
Therese
I just wrote this in a blog but was not sure if it got posted or not so if it does then I apologise for repeating myself.
In Jesus opinion we are all worth saving; in mans many are not.
Our ways are many and varied and to acknowledge anothers way is not to join him/her on it but just to say hi. Its the very least we can do for each other as we find our pathways toward him and his hope of things to come.
ps…an important point to understand. I was in a pastoral position (youth pastorate) and responsible to a Christian board of elderslong BEFORE ever acquiring licensing in Canada. By stating that I “resigned” means from all facets of fulltime ministry. I literally left ministry and sought secular employment. Thus Bene’s frustration that some still refer to me as Reverend or Pastor.
Cheers!!!
TIM….here is an example of your distortion of facts.
“This could be a tough challenge for you though, considering many in the same camp as you (other professing Christians) also disagree with your approach. Maybe you can convince them while you convince me. The ball’s in your court.”
You state that like all of Christendom disagree’s with me…well friend that is far from the case….very far actually.
There are thousands upon thousands of Christians who supported me and have vocalized why. Some for purely freedom of speech reasons and others who agree with both my opinion and my right to voice it.
I am also aware that some do not agree with my opinion or my right to have it both within Christendom and outside of the church. This is not a new dynamic by any means and I encourage the debate within the church.
I hope to touch on some of your other questions/accustations as I can.
Bless you Tim,
Stephen Boissoin
I have heard back from the ECCC.
David Lavigne’s comment (#49) is legitimate and I don’t want to minimize the distress he and his staff have experienced.
Here is what Lavigne had to say.
1) Stephen Boissoin was ordained with the ECCC in 2001, but he was not in good standing.
He is no longer a reverend, no longer credentialed or affiliated with the ECCC, as he has stated here at BDBO and elsewhere.
2) The ECCC did not and do not support the letter to The Red Deer Advocate.
3) Doctrine is not the only issue surrounding the withdrawal of Stephen Boissoin’ ministerial credentials. The ECCC is not going to break confidentiality, and that mandate will be respected.
4) They want no further involvement with Stephen.
I want to thank Mr. Lavigne and the ECCC for their time.
Mr. Lavigne will then have to explain himself to my attorney because his comments are misleading and bordering on slander.
One small point to consider: If I wasn’t in good standing, how did I have a license to solemnize marriages, perform the marriages and fumerals that I did and even have my license parameters expanded by Mr. Lavigne so I could perform my brothers marriage in another Province.
Before God, there has never been a time where Lavinge or his crew has discussed any matter beyond money with me, even when I resinged. They did not withdraw my credentials until that point and I performed marriages up until the year before I resigned.
Only word that comes to mine is and it starts with bull.
What childishness,
Stephen Boissoin
From Dr. Lavinge’s site:
The Evangelical Chriatian Churches Canada
3. Homosexuality is a sinful and unacceptable lifestyle and behavior before God, and the church of Jesus Christ. The ECC will never bless same-sex unions of any kind. We believe that homosexual behavior is “inconsistent with New Testament Christianity.” We believe that God can fully deliver a person from the practice and the inclination of homosexuality.
http://www.cecconline.com/node/5
The homosexual Act is what christians find an abomination. Same sex. If we focus only on the sexual content of someones life then believe me you would not want to be a part of society. We have in action at this time beastiality, bondage, prostitutions ways, and if I am not mistaken a varied society that enjoys its fruits. Many and varied are the ways of man and his desires and its for the most part down to desires. When we see what goes on from the flesh for and by the flesh we are hurt at its deviations, its no good to stop there we must all ask ourselves who planted desire, and we all have them, be it in a large or small portion and then ask that the desire be brought under the covering of the Father while we delve into our hearts to find out what motivated us. Desire is linked in with temptation and theres so much to be tempted by which is how the enemy keeps us ‘off balance’ when on the road to redemptions hope. We are in a battle and should all be there for each other when the battle gets too much and we want’to give up’ or ‘give in’. Never should we load the burden of our battle on someone else’s, that usually brings a breaking point, with its many and varied consequences. We should love the peoples but not necessarily their ways if they offend us. We have all fallen in some way, his grace hangs on to all of us while both he and we get to grips with that which is determind to ‘ drag us down’ and ‘keep us down.’ LOVE NEVER FAILS only we feel like we do sometmes. There is no condemnation in Christ someone once said to me ONLY A HUGE CAPACITY TO LOVE US IN ALL OUR WAYS AND GUIDE US TO A PLACE OF PEACE first with ourselves and then with each others.
The Father always gifts as he redeems us from our ‘hells’ he has too we would die of shame otherwise.
When I say that christians find it an abomination, I am saying that they are the ones who’s vocalisation within a church seting is loudest and the ones we are addressing on this subject at the moment.
Does anyone sense a funky tension in this blog, or is it me. Did not Stephen just contradicted himself AGAIN! He said in the opening email
with Bene B., when why did he signed, and he said”doctrinal issues, mainly eschatological.” Now he said it is over “money.” I take the side of this ECC in Canada – there is more here that what this Stephen B. says.
You know we are the church, so unless we clean ourselves up of judements, heresy, hatred, ’sickness’, and the like and keep always on that pathway then the church will sit, for its lifetime, in the stagnant water of mankind and his delusions. Going to a church is only a part, its joining in with those of a like mind for fellowship and communion. The real meeting of minds is when we take on his, when we never ‘hate’ someone just because they are ‘different’, when we leave behind us the sweet perfume of Jesus and not the stench of man and his wills and ways. He wants us to be in the world but not of it. Thats our journey. Shed that which keeps you in the hands of an enemy that so loves to see us in turmoil and strife and take up his will and life and begin to see through his eyes how the enemy has blinded us all to the real message of Jesus.
When I return how will I find you
In a greater need than ever Lord for your hope of things to come and not the hatred of mankind that so loves to EGO his way through your life and ours. The church is turning him into a ’show piece’ , an entertainment’ a fast buck’. False witness can do that to a person you know, distort them, only when we have every aspect of his passions and love can we be in a position to gift him to others. The pharisees fell short (on their way to fame and fortune and leaderships) and thats why he was angry What do you think you are doing ! making a mockery our of me! HOW DARE YOU was what he was saying in the temple that day. AND SO ‘CLEAN UP YOUR ACT was what he was asking us to do.
When he gifts its always in a place of understanding of, he joins us for a while to show us ‘an act’ that needs cleaning up’ and then
leaves us a little closer to him until we are ready for the next step of the cleansing process. The church would be a lot cleaner if we were. All of us.
In the meantime he quitely and lovingly lifts the veils that hide truth to reveal just how the enemy deceives us and why we are his best interests’ when it comes to gifting to the world a counterfiet Lord. I LOVE HIM BECAUSE IN LOVE HE SHOW’S ME WHO I AM, WHY I AM, AND WHAT I AM. Thankfully theres always room for improvement. His mercy is far greater than mine but I’m getting there and thats the beauty of the journey from hell to hope we take with him, he will allow only that which we are ready for, only that which will bless us, and only that which comes with his authority not ours. I never get bored, and neither does he waiting for me to catch up with him thats why I love him BECAUSE HE FIRST LOVED ME. Its all there if we want it, he honours our choices and patiently waits.
Nothing inconsistent friend.
Issue did revolve around docrine. Nothing different has been stated…although additional details have been added. I think I have been very open and honest conisdering I have little benefit in being so with complete strangers. I can’t understand how you are missing the facts that I have been clearly very consistent with.
Looking for a wolf in sheeps clothing? Typical.
When a person struggles to defend his honor (whatever honor he may has left), he is avoiding telling the truth. You struggle to see the truth here. You say one lie and then you try to find another lie to explain what you meant in the first place.
Why don’t you acknowledge that you are running our of things to say. People on this blog knows that you once belonged to a reputable organization that gave you credentials. You have dishonored their reputation – how you make ask…. not submitting to a higher authority which was placed by God to keep you in check. Did you ask this denomination what there opinion was before you decided to send this horrible letter to this editor of the newspaper?
This denomination and people are saying that you did not. They take a stand on certain positions found on their Position Statement. What you sent to the editor, my opinion, was not their position because they treat people with great respect. Yes homosexualality is a sin, but what you did was wrong according to the Christian community. It is wrong to say things without checking with people to see what their opinions have been in this situation. You have no stand. Who have no honor. What you have are words that say nothing but blah, blah, blah.
May I suggest that you stop looking for excuses to explain why you did what you did, and think of the many people who hurt along the way. If you would have submitted to those people around you, you would not be where you are today. You might be hailed as a Savior for now, but this is only the tip of the iceburg. Your tongue is dangerous, and if you do not head this warning in your life, the future, my friend, does not look good for you!!!
I know you will have a come back on these thoughts, but you will not explain the problems that will soon come upon you as the days get darker in your life. Can you read between the lines or are you you too selfish to admit that you are blinded by the truth – that some how, you are looking for someone to believe in you; to give you a pat on the back and say, you are a wonderful man to confron these people with your truth?
Homosexuals are people too. Why don’t you do what Jesus did when he confronted someone who was found in sin. He never used the truth to hurt them, but he helped them see the truth in a loving manner. You are inncapable of doing that because you are too busy
defending your own honor – hurting those real Christians who are using the Word of God to speak to the heart and minds of many people who are found in sin with the love of God….. They are the true children of God!!!!
“Let God Be True, And Every Man A Liar” – The contradiction is that those who claim to be Christians seek to stir up mischief against a brother in Christ based on the busy bodying and gossip of certain others on this site, one of whom owes Stephen Boissoin a public apology and he knows who he is. Does the prophet hear his conscience?
:
As Christians, we do not tolerate those who claim to be a disciple of Christ, and go out of their way and hurt other people. The Bible calls this false apostles. Stephen B. claims he did the right thing – for himself I ask? If he would have done the right thing, he would have a multitude of counselors around him to make sure that the right checks and balances are in place. Those who think that this man is honest should wake up and smell the coffee!!! I am sorry to see this man get hit with all kinds of opinions, but I can’t seem to get out of mind that the real Christians today are suffering from insults because of men like Stephen who give Christianity a bad name.
Those who know him have already made their comments on this blog. I think when a Bishop makes a remark on this board, I think that this is very serious. I will tell you this much, he won’t have any trouble finding another organization out there who will give this man credentials…,and when he decides again to get credentials, there will be many out there in Alberta who don’t check from the place he once was ordained They want his money……, and now he is a Alberta saviour……They organizations are called mills. Let’s wait to see what “mill” ordains him in the near future!!!
It is the concern of many people who feel this way.
Stephen, I’m still waiting…
I trust things have slowed down with your media frenzy, so perhaps you could now take a moment and respond to me as promised.
I believe the reason why Stephen is silent is due to the fact that he is running out of excuses and it is hard to cover up his lies. He hasn’t said one thing on this blog that makes sense. Matter of fact, he has no proof that he really believes what he says is his faith. All this man is looking for is attention, he he certainly got it!!
I am not saying this to be mean but the I am stating the facts.
Here’s another fact… he has completely avoided answering me, even though he promised he would. I’m still waiting!
Where are you Stephen? I bet I know, you’re probably quite busy organizing a cheer leading squad in support of Pat Robertson’s comments about Haiti. It’s apparent the two of you share the fruit off the same tree.
Has it ever occurred to you guys that Stephen may not regularly read this blog. His email address is in his website and if you sincerely want to chat with him you can contact him. That is of course if your motives are sincere. I am not aware of a single lie that he has told.
Rose, based on the number of posts Stephen has contributed, I can honestly say the thought about him not reading this blog was the furthest thing from my mind. As well, I initiated contact with him through this blog and he promised to reply on this blog. He has yet to do this. Regarding contacting him through other methods, I’m not going to hunt him down just so HE can honor HIS word. He chose this forum and the ball is in his court.
Concerning my sincerity, you bet my motives are sincere and so is my expectation of an answer. I have no interest in a “chat”, I’m simply looking for concise, substantiated answers.
As far as lies go, if he doesn’t respond to me as promised, I guess you could chalk that up as the first one he’s told that you would be aware of.
Sorry if I sound so callous but I’m really sick and tired of men who claim they are the strong moral voice of God/Jesus concerning homosexuality and when they are challenged in their stance, they prove themselves to be nothing more than emasculated homophobes who know nothing about the Bible or the God in it.
Tim you make a sound point. Stephen is running out of excuses and has no reason to find more. He won’t answer you because he is running out of lies. He will argue until his face is blue, but for the most of us, he is not an honest man. He emails people to convince them that he is a righteous man. I am tired too of people who THINK they are moral and have a strong voice on major moral subjects and yet thier life does not line up. I agree that Homosexuallity is a sin, but Stephen does not have the moral right to throw the first stone at anyone!!!!!!
I see no difference between your tone and rhetoric and Boisson’s letter, Tim. His was probably a visceral response to fear for his children’t sake, and it makes me think you have some fears of your own. I pray you will find courage to take an honest look at that some time with the grace and help of the Lord.
Therese:
I admire you very much, I’d like you to know that. You have a heart for people that moves me and I’m glad you are part of the BDBO community.
I think there is a great deal of difference in the tone Tim is using and what Steven Boissoin set out to do years ago. It’s all public record now.
Keep your compassion and grace, we need it. While I appreciate you don’t like Tim challenging Steven, they are adults, give them room to work it out.
Steven Boissoin can’t unring the bell, and I don’t think he cares to.
Bene: “emasculated homophobes”?? I hear the same shrill scream coming from Tim that I heard in Boissoin’s letter. I hope & pray they each will work it out between themselves and God – and sometimes that might begin with a little word to the wise.
I’m tired of battles and arguments, my own and others, tired of not knowing when to come out swinging or keep my mouth shut – I’m tired of not knowing a lot of things, who’s right, who’s wrong – come Lord Jesus and make everything “right” so we can….have peace, with ourselves, with each other and with You!
Stephen, I’m still patiently waiting…
It’s funny how silence actually speaks volumes at times.
As I wait patiently… It’s been almost 3 months… Hello Stephen… Cat got your tongue?