Andrew left his independent fundamentalist church and headed out on his own to grow up and figure out what he wanted to do with his life. He was 20 years old. Andrew landed in Seattle, and on the recommendation of his brother, began attending Mark Driscolls church.
According to Andrew, joining Mars Hill was a good move for him. While he didn’t agree with every theological declaration that came out Mark Driscoll’s mouth, he loved his community, a devoted group of believers who seemed to love, support, and value him the way Jesus commanded. Over the next couple of years, Andrew became well connected. He volunteered. He became active in a community group. He even volunteered on Sundays as church security.
Toward the beginning of 2011, Andrew met and eventually began dating the daughter of a church elder at Mars Hill. The two fell in love quickly. Last fall, they were engaged to be married.
Andrew fooled around one night with a female friend from college. He and his friend did not have sex, but they came close. Andrews conscience took over, he apologized to his fellow student and went to tell his fiancee, who is the daughter of a church elder. She was devastated, and Andrew went to a Mars Hill small group friend and confessed. He was heartbroken and repentant.
What happened next was this churches concept of discipline run amok, legalism, control and authoritarian leadership crushing the work of the Holy Spirit in this young man’s life. The comments under Andrews story are piling up, as would be expected in any discussion of the neo-Calvinist and bombastic world of Mars Hill. His experience is not surprising to many familiar with this sub-culture.
There isn’t much talk about Andrew’s former fiancee.
As so often is the case with church drama like this, the following month was, for Andrew, filled up with meetings. A meeting with his old community group leader (he was forced to join a new community group). A meeting with his new community group leader. A meeting with his fiancée’s step-father. A meeting with his trusted friend who also happened to be the leader of his mens small group. So many meetings. And some of those meetings required second meetings.
Over the course of that month, Andrew also confessed more of his sexual baggage/history.
“I confessed to my mens small group leader–a close friend of mine–that my relationship with my fiancée was physical, too.”
That confession led to more meetings and more than enough long (and sometimes ridiculous) text message conversations with church leadership at Mars Hill.
“On several occasions, I was called a Wolf,” says Andrew, “which at Mars Hill, is like the worst thing you can be called.”
I ask him why.
“Because it means you’re a man who preys on innocent people–nothing more than a predator.”
According to Andrew, at Mars Hill, the cliche “it takes two to tango” isn’t true. Why? Because Pastor Mark teaches that women are “weaker vessels,” and therefore, when a girl and boy engage in consensual sexual activity, it is always assumed that it’s the man’s fault because he failed to lead the woman (or “weaker vessel”) toward righteousness. (And everybody knows that women can’t find righteousness unless a man leads her there. Ugh.)
As group leaders and a pastor made this story public to church members she is publicly named and shamed in the next discipline letter. No word on a disciple contract for her. She has chosen to stay at Mars Hill, she has dutifully chosen her default role as victim. Andrew is given ultimatums from those he turned to for help.
Plan of Discipline
- Andrew will attend XXX’s CG and meet with XXX on a regular basis (define)
- Andrew will not be involved in serving at MH
- Andrew will not pursue or date any woman inside or outside of MH
- Andrew will write out in detail his sexual and emotional attachment history with women and share it with XXX.
- Andrew will write out in detail the chronology of events and sexual/emotional sin with K and share it with XXX and Pastor X.
- Andrew will write out a list of all people he has sinned against during this time frame, either by sexual/emotional sin, lying or deceiving, share it with XXX and develop a plan to confess sin and ask for forgiveness
What happens next is an eye opener, as church members are told exactly how to ‘restore Andrew with Mars Hill ‘love’ toward a remorseful, repentant young man trying to find his way.
There is a post-script, from the brother who introduced Andrew to Mars Hill.
Over the last couple of days, I have followed – with something more than dispassionate interest – the conversations happening on this blog and around the blogosphere about the way Mars Hill handles church discipline and the ways that people find many of their actions indistinguishable from a cult. I’ve read story after story after story, in blog comments, on other blogs, and in e-mails, that all share a common refrain: this is my story, too. Every one of them breaks my heart. But the story Matthew recounted here means more to me than all the rest. Andrew is my brother. He first started going to Mark Driscoll’s church on my recommendation, years ago when I was first stepping outside of the fundamentalism we had grown up in and trying to find out what my faith would look like. I was attracted to Driscoll’s style that so closely resembled the preachers I heard growing up, only with more of an edge and more cussing, and it took several years for me to realize how small of a step I had taken outside of the fundamentalism of my childhood. Walking with Andrew through this now, I am haunted by the fact that, less than ten years ago, I almost certainly would have followed the pastors demands and broken off all contact with anyone they deemed unrepentant or unworthy of grace and love, with no questions asked.
That is why I decided to write this. – Stephen
Part one of Andrews story: Mark Driscoll’s church discipline contract: Looking for true repentance at Mars Hill church? Sign on the dotted line.
Part two of Andrews story: Mark Driscoll’s ‘gospel shame’: The truth about discipline, excommunication and cult-like control at Mars Hill
Update: Mars Hill responds with a brief statement and a chapter from one a Mark Driscoll book.
Frustrating. Troubling. Disconcerting. Sad. Frightening. I will freely admit that I underwent my own church discipline in 2000 at Overlake Christian Church and this story horrifyingly reminds me my own account, with much pain and trembling, even 12 years later. My heart BREAKS for Andrew. My flesh CRAWLS at reading this article. We are to be Jesus with skin on. We are to faithfully administer God’s GRACE in its various forms. Legalistic tarring and feathering of God’s chosen people, His royal priesthood, His holy nation, does NOT result in better community or better growth. It results in an impoverished church, a beleaguered sense of trust in God and the body of Christ, and cultivates a climate of fear-based worship where God’s children are walking on eggshells. I can only imagine what Andrew must feel right now. Andrew, I love you in Jesus’ Name. You are repentant, you have repented, and you are forgiven. I do not know you, I have never met you, but you are LOVED IN JESUS’ NAME. I am deeply proud of you for bringing your sin into the light, and for bringing Mars Hill’s leadership’s sin into the light as well. Knowing church discipline all too well, I can freely also admit that one sin that cost me my position of leadership, my community at the church, my connection to the body of Christ there, etc., also eventually lead to an even greater sin which cost me my freedom and sent me to prison. I do not blame my actions on the church or the leadership, but I will indefatigably say that there is an inexorable tie between the church discipline / excommunication I received from Overlake Christian Church, and my eventual crime. Do I wish I could take back my crime? Yes. But I also wish with all my heart that I could take back the church discipline I received, and replace it with something restorative like a warm hug. Alas, warm hugs are not mentioned in Scripture for those undergoing church discipline. And such a legalistic, grace-lacking approaches only send us further down the drain, with no hope of compassionate restoration. Wash your hands of us if you will, you beloved megachurches, and in the process so subsequently condemn yourselves as unloving, uncompassionate, and unbiblical. Jesus loves me the same that he does me, and that is my Amen, because truthfully I’d rather ALWAYS be the guy beating his chest, saying “God be merciful to me, a sinner” than be you.
After reading this article there appears to be other problems involved.
One – By forcing Andrew to take further steps other than genuine confession and repentance displays a sever lack of grace on the part of the leadership. It is understood that there is no an opportunity for him to take any leadership role at this time but the extensive actions he is taking is not a biblical one. He conceived the sin but did not act on it. The fact of his remorse is proof of the Holy Spirit conviction that others at the church may need to find. Repentance removes the direction of sin because a soul can change but the act of sin leaves behind devastation behind.
Two – This is personal commentary. His quote ex-fiancé sounds as if she has not the love of Christ. He made a mistake and realized it. I guess no others at Mars Hill has ever made any mistakes. Never knew a church to be so perfect. Perhaps they need a good lesson in forgiveness and a good dose of grace themselves. Pray for Andrew that he will find a church that has such grace. Let the Pharisees have their legalism. Amen.
I am so grateful for articles and blogs such as this dealing with the very serious issue of spiritual abuse and legalistic “church discipline”. How many are there out there who have gone through such a hideous stripping down and scourging like Andrew did, only in a more local venue? From my own personal experience and research, the victims of such abuse must surely number in the hundreds of thousands. It’s much more common than most people recognize.
The gentle and compassionate Jesus would never beat his sheep unmercifully like these people battered and chewed on Andrew.
John 8:
7So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.
8And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground.
9And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst.
10When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee?
11She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.”
The scriptural account indicates the woman’s accusers were convicted by their consciences. I don’t see much of this in Mar’s Hill’s damage control statements.
Where so many witnesses have come forward, one has to recognize there is substance to Andrew’s story.
I seem to feel a growing sense of outrage rising up against the abuses being perpetrated in the very household of God.
I realize we are talking about a different church than I attended, but the first commenter mentioned OCC and I almost threw up! As a former member of Overlake Christian Church (1970′s – 80′s) I can say that this type of hypocrical “religious” spirit is not unique. I experienced so much trauma at OCC that was beyond belief.
It is widespread knowlege that the head pastor during those years ended up resigning due to allegations of homosexual molestation (both in a public bathroom in FL and during baptisms at the actual church!!!) WTF??? That explained a LOT to me. My abuse was by a visiting youth pastor from Canada. OCC knew he was a child molestor, yet never told my parents that and simply placed him in our home when I was just a small child. Nearly 37+ years later, I am just coming to grips with the damage he did to me physically, emotionally and spiritually (I cannot have children, I no longer believe in God, and won’t step foot in another church if you offered me a million dollars). I was too y0ung to remember the full details of the pastor who molested and raped me (I only know his first name). But I remember the ongoing molestation and eventual brutal rape in every vivid, evil, ugly detail. Overlake did NOTHING except let him flee back to Canada.
I feel so sorry for the man, Andrew, featured in this story. Yes, he faltered, but he confessed and tried to make amends. These holier-than-thou pastors/elders/deacons/etc. blew the situation out of proportion, probably ruined Andrews’s views on Christianity (as did my abuser) and it’s an appalling, sad and painful story to read. All these churches just make me sick.
Andrew, I hope you find the peace you seek in those who will actually love you unconditioanally, forgive your faults and help you to heal. I only hope you can find a trusted therapist that will help you heal now instead of burying it like I did for nearly 40 years.
Dude, Exchristian, I feel your pain and I am truly sorry. Truly, truly sorry – the church has failed you and I wish that it had not. Sometimes there are no words, so I won’t try – other than to say that I am truly sorry and wish that the church had truly been “Jesus with skin on” for you. Don’t give up on Jesus though men befoul his name, thinking that they’re working IN his name. God bless you on your journey.
You know, maybe if Jesus would just show up for once and strike down the imposters who are defaming him, I would also say, don’t give up on Jesus. However, to date he has watched the suffering and abuse from afar with indifference. Are those the actions of a good father, a loving god? Healing comes by moving on from hope in a fictional saviour. We are our own saviours. Let the dead bury the dead (the body of Christ) and be free.
No, healing comes from a real savior, which Jesus is. It appears you are looking for a superhero. Jesus heals and saves and restores everyday in ways that we cannot see: in the subtle underpinnings and trappings of our lives, not by swooping in and fighting off every evil assault or injustice. I am evidence to how much restoration and redemption a person can experience through love and service to my Lord Jesus Christ.
…What a truly ignorant statement!..”You know, maybe if Jesus would just show up for once and strike down the imposters who are defaming him, I would also say, don’t give up on Jesus. However, to date he has watched the suffering and abuse from afar with indifference. ”
HIS Throne is built on Justice & Righteousness
Only a fool would challenge this!
Brano, only a fool would defend the character and reputation of someone whom to this day is proving to be non-existant, evidenced by a total lack of presence, or better put, complete absence. If you can so righteously defend your Jesus, don’t you dare consider me a fool for defending Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny or any of the other thousands of gods that were worshipped prior to your Jesus supposedly arriving on the scene.
LMAO….”If you can so righteously defend your Jesus, don’t you dare consider me a fool for defending Santa Claus or the Easter Bunny ”
Thanks for the belly laugh!
Brano, let me say that big belly laugh with you!
Thanks TLBC,
I had a flash back to philosophy 101…LMAO!
I would also urge Andrew to have the courage to be he own God and instead of worshiping MarsHillChurch, have that courage to worship himself!
Ryan you are deluded if you believe in the mythical European Jesus, a character fabricated by the ancient Egyptians that predated the annals of Moses by 2000 years. Jesus is no more than a reinvented Horus the Christ, son of the Egyptian god, Osiris. Catholic bishops stole the Horus story, including virgin birth, death, resurrection and salvation of souls and redacted these basis elements into the new religion called Christianity, changing the name Horus to Jesus, of course.
Your “Jesus” in not authentic. He is nothing more than a copy of a god invented by a previous civilization, passed down and reinvented for the purpose of uniting the people of the Roman Empire under one religious and cultural system, thereby strengthening the imperialism of the state. In 381 the new religion with Saviour Jesus at the wheel, was imbued with power, not from “on high”, but from the Empire. It was forced to death upon everyone in the land, accumulating great wealth in the process, thus the reason it flourished and lasted to this day. It wasn’t the power of the Lord, but the power of the sword that made the belief stick.
If you know nothing about this, save your comments and do your homework instead. You have been taught a lie. They will not teach you this in bible school or seminary. You have to learn this all by yourself. Most don’t want to know, but don’t take my word for it – research. Be open minded, not openly credulous.
If I am correct, Brano would have sanction my burning in those days, with the love of Christ.
That would be incorrect mr.chung
GOD has a way of doing,and taking care of, HIS business…
ps,The last thing Christendom needs,is another crusade!
But it was the first thing it needed.
The doctrine of trinity indeed was the cause of many untimely death. Calvin sanctioned the murder of Servetus. He was burnt by the will of god.
I totally agree with Marina, that the story of Christianity has some very ungodly influence! Brano, have you considered that you could be deluded with an ancient hoax?
Lets consider that:”I totally agree with Marina, that the story of Christianity has some very ungodly influence! ”
Does one then do the childish, uneducated ,knee-jerk thing and throw the baby out with the bath water?
Bizaro at best!
Bizaro indeed! One wakes up and found that this earth is not flat anymore! The universe is so large that we are no longer the centre! Is that bath water or the baby you are referring to?
Folks – we live in a fallen world – where mankind is lost. A fallen world. Sin is rampant. Sin literally means “to miss the mark”. For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God.
BUT God has made a way for reconciliation unto Himself and this was through the shed blood of Jesus. His death for the sins of all mankind, burial and resurrection. Sin has been overcome.
Each one on this planet (past, present and future) has an opportunity to seek God and understand that there is none righteous, not one! None! Only Jesus the pure and spotless lamb. Sinless and perfect who was sacrificed once and for all for our sins. To pay that price on our behalf once and for all.
By repenting and believing that Jesus truly is the Christ and our Redeemer we have the hope of everlasting life! Such hope!!
But we STILL live in a fallen world. Christ is our Redeemer, Healer and Way to life everlasting, and we can trust in Him to continually bring us into relationship with Him. He is coming again…as He promised.
